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 Post subject: Re: CAVCON Meter
PostPosted: Wed Mar 19, 2014 6:35 pm 
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Obduction Backer

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I just want remind everyone that due to the server issues we have had lately it raise the Cavcon meter up so please donate in appreciation to cyan on being on top of things. :)


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 Post subject: Re: CAVCON Meter
PostPosted: Wed Mar 19, 2014 9:20 pm 
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zeke3651 wrote:
I just want remind everyone that due to the server issues we have had lately it raise the Cavcon meter up so please donate in appreciation to cyan on being on top of things. :)


good point, zeke3651 :)

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 Post subject: Re: CAVCON Meter
PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:57 am 
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I went to a real-life St Paddys Day celebration this year and collected for Moul(a)...I was amazed...I will be contributing $100 because I'm cute..lol

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 Post subject: Re: CAVCON Meter
PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2014 8:37 am 
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Charura wrote:
I went to a real-life St Paddys Day celebration this year and collected for Moul(a)...I was amazed...I will be contributing $100 because I'm cute..lol

Three cheers for Charura!

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 Post subject: Re: CAVCON Meter
PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 8:49 pm 
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Despite Charura's generous gesture, we still only made 2.8 for March. Not a disaster by any means, but below par.

(8 out of 10 - could do better)

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 Post subject: Re: CAVCON Meter
PostPosted: Tue Apr 08, 2014 8:59 pm 
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Added funds yesterday.


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 Post subject: Re: CAVCON Meter
PostPosted: Fri Apr 18, 2014 10:47 am 
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RAWA wrote:
Account Stats as of 4/16/14
Total Accounts created: 128274

CAVCON: 2.8 (March, final) Thanks!!
CAVCON Donation Meter: 2.0 (April, in progress, as of 4/14/14)
Just to say...

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 Post subject: Re: CAVCON Meter
PostPosted: Fri Apr 18, 2014 7:20 pm 
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Aha! I hadn't actually spotted that - I usually just watch for the CAVCON number changing as a cue that RAWA has posted new data, so I missed it because it's still 2.0 :(

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 Post subject: Re: CAVCON Meter
PostPosted: Fri Apr 18, 2014 9:57 pm 
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It was similar in February. Most of the time it was hardly 2.x but it closed with over 4. Maybe updating the CavCon status is at the moment at a rather low priority.
But (now image a Doomsday Voice) maybe I'm wrong and there really are no donations :shock:


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 Post subject: Re: CAVCON Meter
PostPosted: Fri Apr 18, 2014 10:23 pm 
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cpt-jericho wrote:
Maybe updating the CavCon status is at the moment at a rather low priority.
It sure would appear so.
I can verify that I did my twice-annual donation just a week ago. While it's not a fortune, I'd hope it would have kicked CAVCON out of 2.0 status, so I doubt a check-and-update has happened at all in April.

I'll say it again: the less real-time CAVCON reporting is, the less incentive we have to donate...and conversely, I believe that if we could see an almost-immediate CAVCON response upon donating, the gratification factor would be enormous, to say nothing of the reassurance factor.

I've pointed out before that there are means to automate reportage of Paypal numbers on a website such as Cyan's. We all probably agree that Cyan is very unlikely to implement that type of system, or any other improvement to the CAVCON system at this point.

I've wondered numerous times whether a fan-run URU donation system could be made transparent enough that the fans would trust it with their money?

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 Post subject: Re: CAVCON Meter
PostPosted: Fri Apr 18, 2014 11:43 pm 
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1) Real time. Incentive. Response. Automate. It's always amused me how exactly these posts match the whole history of The Lake Lighting Project discussion if you just replace every mention of "donation" with "pellet."

2) Fan-run donation System: What's stopping you from starting one? ;) I'm reasonable sure that if you were to attempt it, the challenges would become clear. Nothing educates better than practical experience.

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 Post subject: Re: CAVCON Meter
PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 1:09 am 
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JWPlatt wrote:
1) Real time. Incentive. Response. Automate. It's always amused me how exactly these posts match the whole history of The Lake Lighting Project discussion if you just replace every mention of "donation" with "pellet."
It sounds like you're trying to ridicule the whole idea of seeing CAVCON donations in anything finer than one-month intervals.
If you'd like to have a discussion of the differences between the arcane manner in which the pellet/lake lighting was at one time "structured" and the way donations/CAVCON numbers could be reported in the future, I'll be happy to participate, because I believe your analogy is a very poor one.

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2) Fan-run donation System: What's stopping you from starting one? ;) I'm reasonable sure that if you were to attempt it, the challenges would become clear. Nothing educates better than practical experience.
You are clearly stating at least a couple things here:
1) "You are unclear on the challenges inherent in starting/operating a fan-run donation system."
2) "You have no practical experience in such things."

You seem to know a lot about me, Mr. Platt, in order to be so condescending.
But you have not addressed the only question I really asked: whether a completely transparent fan-run donation system could elicit trust?

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 Post subject: Re: CAVCON Meter
PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 4:25 am 
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Emor D'ni Lap wrote:
It sounds like you're trying to ridicule the whole idea of seeing CAVCON donations in anything finer than one-month intervals.

Not at all. Anyone who knows the history of my involvement in, and enthusiasm for, the Lake Project and pellets also know I made the same exact points as you do about CAVCON. I continue to this day to receive the daily pellet point tracking from IC Dr. Watson since 2007 to honor the commitment Mr. Laxman made to me for my IC efforts in MOUL (I just need to get around to posting the data - RAWA has been far better with reporting CAVCON than I have the pellet data). The parallels are what make it personally amusing to me, especially the one about maintaining a steady pace without dips and spikes. The point of the similarity between the pellets and CAVCON has been raised previously in this thread, and RAWA has specifically mentioned to me that the point is not lost on him.

Emor D'ni Lap wrote:
...you have not addressed the only question I really asked: whether a completely transparent fan-run donation system could elicit trust?

I don't know. I do know it would be a challenge. I'm saying I'd like to see you make a commitment, try to organize it, and see it through. Lots of people suggest things, but expect others to implement it for them. Sooner or later it's up to someone to stop waiting and implement the idea already. Maybe your efforts could be different, but there's always resistance from others not doing the work against those who do because they question who has the right to make the vision a reality. What gives you the right? They'll ask you that. The answer - the thing that gives you the right - is that you have the vision and courage to try, even through the minefields of your critics, where others don't. That's the trust you're talking about - or whoever makes the effort. It will have to be earned. A lot of projects are started, often by popular people, but not completed or stopped dead when when they get tired or burned out and leave the community. That's a very hard history to overcome. Make sure it's a commitment you will keep, because if you don't, your critics were right. But you have to start somewhere. Good luck.

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 Post subject: Re: CAVCON Meter
PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 3:10 pm 
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Excellent advice. This should be pinned somewhere for everyone who's ever had an idea to do something in this community to read.
[Reveal] Spoiler: Just Do It
JWPlatt wrote:
I'd like to see you make a commitment, try to organize it, and see it through. Lots of people suggest things, but expect others to implement it for them. Sooner or later it's up to someone to stop waiting and implement the idea already. Maybe your efforts could be different, but there's always resistance from others not doing the work against those who do because they question who has the right to make the vision a reality. What gives you the right? They'll ask you that. The answer - the thing that gives you the right - is that you have the vision and courage to try, even through the minefields of your critics, where others don't. That's the trust you're talking about - or whoever makes the effort. It will have to be earned. A lot of projects are started, often by popular people, but not completed or stopped dead when when they get tired or burned out and leave the community. That's a very hard history to overcome. Make sure it's a commitment you will keep, because if you don't, your critics were right. But you have to start somewhere. Good luck.

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 Post subject: Re: CAVCON Meter
PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 6:33 pm 
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Emor D'ni Lap wrote:
... I'd hope it would have kicked CAVCON out of 2.0 status, so I doubt a check-and-update has happened at all in April.

Actually, there has. That why I said in my post that I'd missed the update. RAWA posted the March final figures fairly promptly at the beginning of April and reset CAVCON to 2.0 and at that point there were no weekly metrics for April available. TCB The Scar's post alerted me to the fact that RAWA had added new weekly data, but the telling comment is this one (emphasis mine):
RAWA wrote:
CAVCON Donation Meter: 2.0 (April, in progress, as of 4/14/14)
In other words, by mid-April whatever donations had been made were not enough to even nudge CAVCON up to 2.1.

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