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PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2016 10:03 pm 
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Sorry, Larry, but I've spent time observing the "whatever-fall" myself, and it's a waterfall in the way it flows and bends. OOCly speaking, that is a water texture, plain and simple. ICly, and Scientifically, Neutrino beams must be produced by *emitters.* They don't occur in *concentrated streams* (or even wispy-waterfall-ish streams, for that matter) in the wild as far as I've ever known- and since a close relative of mine had Neutrino beam treatments for medical reasons, I consider the information I was told on it generally more solid than most. I may be wrong on some of the details, as it was some years ago that I was told the pertinent details, however I do remember that beams such as that need to be produced to be viable in any form.

If this *is* a second neutrino beam, where is the emitter, and if it's on the cave ceiling- *why* did the D'ni put it that high up? If you're producing a stream of Neutrinos, why not just put it inside the Beam emitter in the first place as seems to be the case? If this *IS* a stream of neutrinos and not a waterfall- what of the dispersal distance? As the end result scanner beam doesn't remain visible past Ae'gura, that implies that there is a rather short half-life to the particles produced that doesn't last beyond a certain distance. Why add even more distance into a particle-generator--to--collector--to--particle-emitter cycle? It's more efficient for the D'ni to just take an existing waterfall and make use of it to aid in the whole-sale generation of Neutrino Particles, and put all of the heavy particle generating devices in the center of a huge pool of water that may very well be electrically charged and unsafe to touch, thus keeping anyone who isn't *supposed* to be near the heavy machinery from being there?

My personal assumption on the matter, back in the Second Restoration, was that when the GZ is active, the waterfall generates some kind of electric current- which is then put into use generating the Neutrino beam. Now a days, I suspect the waterfall provides the water for the pool that the GZ Beam Emitter rests in, serving as some form of cooling and/or grounding system.

I think only Cyan/The DRC know *exactly* how this Neutrino beam is generated, and whether or not the "whatever-fall" is a part of it or not. That said, we only have access to the surface level of the GZ complex. There's a subsection that's locked behind two doors that we've never gotten access to, and may likely never will, at this point. Could be there's just the "On/Off Switch", or a whole slew of maintenance panels. Or, for all we know, the "whatever-fall" could just be decorative and there's some strange, unknown mechanic that we're unaware of that's a part of this whole thing! Could be Geo-thermal energies, or it could be there's Esher running on a treadmill chasing after the Bahro tablet.

@Jamie: The TL:DR if it is: We just don't know if we have all of the necessary information to make a guess on what is going on in the entire GZ Neutrino Beam production. The closest answer we ever could formulate was "It's a Hydro-electric powered Neutrino Generator. /shrug"

[Reveal] Spoiler: /Myst-Busters
Now, we could ask someone at Cyan if they know how it works....but I doubt we'll get a straight answer regarding it, if only to prevent someone from stupidly building their *own* neutrino generator at home despite all the disclaimers at the beginning of the show saying "don't try this at home."

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 5:39 am 
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larryf58 wrote:
Any three-dimensional object in the game is canon.


Yeeeah no. Unless there really is a large cube hidden under the cleft, and of course there is the Zamboni...

I guess all the floating flora outside of Kemo which is just a floating in an empty void is canon too..


On a side note the water coming in at the GZ "pond" is a waterfall, it was a source of water that was a contributing factor to why Ri'Neref built the city where it was.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 11:40 am 
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Calumon wrote:
[...] and since a close relative of mine had Neutrino beam treatments for medical reasons, I consider the information I was told on it generally more solid than most. I may be wrong on some of the details, as it was some years ago that I was told the pertinent details, however I do remember that beams such as that need to be produced to be viable in any form.


Are you thinking of neutron beams? Neutrinos and neutrons are very different particles: neutrinos have extremely weak interactions with matter.

Since neutrinos are invisible, I don't think we're seeing them directly anywhere, whether above or in the Great Zero. The D'ni obviously knew things about neutrinos that we don't, so it's possible they were able to create some kind of light-producing reaction signalling the passage of a neutrino beam. (Assuming the beam is composed of neutrinos and not just some preliminary effect necessary to activate the dispenser.)

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 1:44 pm 
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The light could be Cherenkov radiation - it's the only possible thing that could make a neutrino beam give off blue light. Unless, of course, it's not actually a neutrino beam.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2016 4:16 pm 
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Talashar wrote:
Calumon wrote:
[...] and since a close relative of mine had Neutrino beam treatments for medical reasons, I consider the information I was told on it generally more solid than most. I may be wrong on some of the details, as it was some years ago that I was told the pertinent details, however I do remember that beams such as that need to be produced to be viable in any form.


Are you thinking of neutron beams? Neutrinos and neutrons are very different particles: neutrinos have extremely weak interactions with matter.


[Reveal] Spoiler: probably off topic
Ah, now that you say that, "Neutrons" does sound more accurate... but to a more recent treatment that was had just this year. :? *scratches head in confusion* It *might* have been Neutrons both times, but I distinctly remember hearing the word "Neutrino" thrown about during the previous treatment with regards to what was going on. Maybe my grandparents were just mispronouncing the word? *shrugs*


KathAveara wrote:
The light could be Cherenkov radiation - it's the only possible thing that could make a neutrino beam give off blue light. Unless, of course, it's not actually a neutrino beam.


Cherenkov radiation? *Googles* Yeah, that would fit the blue glow of both the emitted beam *and* the pond the Emitter Pillars reside in.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 6:39 am 
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I remember what its powered by now

[Reveal] Spoiler:
3DS max and a plasma game engine :P

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 2:14 pm 
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Haha Karkadann

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 01, 2016 6:13 pm 
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I fully expected to see a "reverse the polarity of the neutron flow" remark on this thread....

Seriously, though: if the GZ just supposed to act as a GPS, how exactly does it affect our KIs? (In Cavern, of course)

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 01, 2016 6:19 pm 
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I always though it was some sort of WiFi.(off course the Den'i would have a different name for it.)

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 01, 2016 9:43 pm 
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F'iwi? Or Fiw'i?

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 01, 2016 9:50 pm 
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@Charura LOL

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 02, 2016 3:28 pm 
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Here's my speculation on the workings of the GZ.

As we know, it fires out a neutrino beam across the whole cavern. My theory is this: encoded in that beam is the current angle of the GZ, and each 'slice' encodes its own vertical angle. The KI, upon being hit by the beam, extracts the two angles from the beam, and uses the attenuation of the beam to determine radial distance from the GZ. This provides a full set of spherical coordinates, which are trivial to transform into the KI coordinates we know and love. This wouldn't provide a real-time system, only updating every rotation of the GZ, but it's consistent with what we can observe of the GZ.

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