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PostPosted: Mon Dec 02, 2013 2:30 am 
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Many apologies in advance if this has been asked before, but I haven't made a new Explorer avatar in a LONG time. The latest changelog I found mentioned the Cyan and Yeesha movies being removed, but nothing about this new video that involves staring at cave paintings while slowly rotating. And no sound. And you have to press Esc to get past it. So how far out of the loop am I? :lol:

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 02, 2013 4:39 am 
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You have to return almost "exactly" 12 months backward in time...on Dec 3rd, 2012

RAD Game Tools contacted Cyan and asked them to remove any asset related to the intro video. It has been done finally on June 11th, 2013. In the meantime, it was impossible to create an account. If you had an account already, you were fine & could keep using the client. All the other clients & the MOUL-based shards were available only if you had access to them prior.

Right now, you will just be in an endless loop with the bahroglyphs wall showing. Just hit "Esc" and keep going ahead with the game. I think there must be a legacy video somewhere on the Internet showing you what was that video sequence.

The deal with the "new intro video" is that there's none :wink:

Other explorers might be more helpful or add/correct my info.

See this link for instance:
http://mystonline.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=26114&hilit=bink

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 02, 2013 2:42 pm 
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You wanna see the old intro?
An ~.mp4 copy is in this list at IndyURU
(It's best to right-click to link in new tab or window so you don't link out of the forum)

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 2:02 am 
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I guess Cyan just didn't care about the videos anymore? It's not like Uru used them a lot...

At any rate, the background with the cave paintings was always there, but less noticeable when it actually had a video play over it.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 5:45 am 
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Ehren wrote:
I guess Cyan just didn't care about the videos anymore?


I don't know all the details, but I believe there was a copyright issue with the software used to design the videos, so they had to be removed.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 6:44 am 
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Shorah all,

An emergency situation was discovered exactly one year ago today which led to the removal of the Bink assets from all MOULa open source repositories. The details can be read here and here. Since Bink is what drives the intro video, said video now no longer plays.

I don't happen to know what the MOULa open source community has been doing to rectify this (although I believe it's been on their to-do list). It's highly unlikely that Cyan will do anything significant to develop an alternate means to play the intro video; it's much more likely they will leave its resolution in the hands of the OpenUru folks.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 05, 2013 6:08 am 
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HarveyMidnight wrote:
Ehren wrote:
I guess Cyan just didn't care about the videos anymore?


I don't know all the details, but I believe there was a copyright issue with the software used to design the videos, so they had to be removed.


With Open Source, but Cyan themselves could have kept using it for the official MOULa client.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 05, 2013 8:05 am 
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Shorah Ehren,

Yes, I think that technically, Cyan would be within their rights to continue using Bink assets here on MOULa.

[Reveal] Spoiler: Pure speculation on my part
However, my sense from revisiting the old conversations/threads about this is that there was a great deal more to the situation we don't really know (and which Cyan has understandably kept private). Chogon's initial communication to JWPlatt (which JWPlatt included in his initial post) certainly sounds like Cyan had received a sudden, unexpected and seriously threatening communication from RAD Tools (perhaps a hostile letter from RAD's lawyers with an ultimatum and demand for payment of the fine specified in their contract). If this is the case, then it appears that RAD was uninterested in finding a friendly solution to the issue; and that whatever the penalty amount was, Cyan could ill afford it. Which leads me to wonder if Cyan decided to sever all ties with RAD rather than risk their continuing scrutiny and the possibility of future legal conflict and expenses.

Anyhow, I know if I found myself in a similar situation, I'd prefer to wash my hands of such unpleasantness and move on...

The Bink assets were removed from MOULa at the next update after the December 2012 chain of events, Build 918 which was rolled out by OpenUru this past June. Chogon's announcement of the build release certainly looks like Bink's removal was an immense relief for Cyan. Reading the development notes for the build, it looks like the team hopes to re-add the videos later, but there is no indication where this task might be on their priority lists. The most recent build was rolled back so quickly that I didn't see whether it included an update to the videos or not.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 05, 2013 9:32 am 
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Ainia wrote:
Yes, I think that technically, Cyan would be within their rights to continue using Bink assets here on MOULa.
Chogon wrote:
whoever at Cyan wrote plLayerBink.cpp had copied the code nearly verbatim from the RAD Tools SDK sample code. And that is what is in violation of Cyan's agreement with RAD Tools.
http://forums.openuru.org/viewtopic.php?f=91&t=848#p7526


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 05, 2013 10:32 am 
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Basically it weren't the assets/videos that were the issue, but the way the client played them.The code that did this should never have been open sourced. When this was discovered, the code in question was removed from all repositories.
This was only really noticable in Cyan's client , because the open source clients are built without the Blink SDK(it isn't available for free), so the intro videos were skipped already. This might also be a better solution for Cyan, but I don't know how easy it is to apply it in their build system.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 05, 2013 10:35 am 
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Shorah Stone.

Better clarification of the SDK sample issue can be viewed in JWPlatt's post farther down in that same thread. He explains that Cyan did nothing wrong in copying/repurposing the SDK code, as that was within their licensed rights. The problem is with the redistribution of that copied/repurposed code as open source.

From the subsequent postings about that point, it seems that if Cyan had written their own code rather than using the sample code from the SDK, all would have remained well in distributing it as open source. I think it was one of those development events that are easily forgotten/overlooked years after the fact.

[[Edit: Hey lunanne! You beat me to it!! :) ]]

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 05, 2013 6:50 pm 
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Umm. Ok, I thought that was extremely clear from the countless posts explaining this.
Edit: I may have read the intent of your posts incorrectly. My comment here did not help in any way so i just removed the rest before it derailed this thread. I hope you are not writing a response as i change this. sorry.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 05, 2013 10:43 pm 
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Shorah Stone.

Sorry, this conversation may indeed have been a bit confusing. I read Ehren's question as a point of confusion about why Cyan felt a need to make these changes to their own code here on MOULa since it clearly was *not* in violation of the RAD SDK terms. (That is, Cyan still retains possession, ownership, oversight, etc.)

I agree, it's pretty clear from the old threads that there was a problem with the code Cyan had released to the community as open source. It's not clear why Cyan decided to apply this change to MOULa too, which is what I was speculating about in my second post.

And I agree, we have flogged this poor horse enough! :? Time to move on to more interesting conversations!

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 05, 2013 11:18 pm 
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Ainia wrote:
I read Ehren's question as a point of confusion about why Cyan felt a need to make these changes to their own code here on MOULa since it clearly was *not* in violation of the RAD SDK terms.

but maybe a violation of the GPL terms


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 5:40 am 
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It's my understanding that Cyan removed Bink from their own client in order to keep the number of differences between the Cyan client and the OpenUru client to a minimum.

Every little difference between the OpenUru client and the Cyan client results in additional time and effort that must be spent when merging changes from one to the other.

For insight into an example of this, see this posting from rarified at the OpenUru forums.

(It's worth noting that the H'uru client, used by Gehn shard, is free from such "obligations" which is one reason it is able to advance with new features and improvements so much more quickly. Thanks always to Christian W. who I understand has been the point person in funneling H'uru code into OpenUru so that it can eventually make its way to Cyan's client. And thank you for the H'uru developers who are out there making the improvements!)

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