It is currently Thu Nov 21, 2019 4:20 am

All times are UTC




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 53 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4
Author Message
PostPosted: Tue Sep 15, 2015 5:20 pm 
Offline
Former MystOnline Moderator

Joined: Fri Nov 10, 2006 3:05 pm
Posts: 4202
Location: 56°2'26", -3°20'28"
The question of white vs black lists comes down to whether there are more word forms you want to block than those you want to allow. In the specific case that AlanD raises, I can see maybe two words from that root that you might want to block (and even then it depends on context) and lots more that should be allowed, so blacklisting is the easier thing to do. It means you need to put in a rule for each of those two words, instead of the single [word]* rule that seems to be present and the cause of several problems. Whitelisting means you need to try to think of all the words you want to allow and that's almost bound to be incomplete and therefore more confusing and disappointing when you hit on one of the omissions.

_________________
Image Mac - MOULagain KI#00004826 00004289
In the interests of the environment, this post has been constructed entirely from recycled electrons.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Tue Sep 15, 2015 7:01 pm 
Offline
Creative Kingdoms

Joined: Tue May 09, 2006 8:06 pm
Posts: 6229
Location: Everywhere, all at once
A whitelist could be an exception, or local rule, to the overall global blacklist, making it minimal.

_________________
OpenUru.org: An Uru Project Resource Site : Twitter : Make a commitment.
Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2015 12:19 am 
Offline
Obduction Backer

Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2013 11:06 am
Posts: 630
Location: UK: Now with added Magic
I postulated a whitelist, thinking of using it for exceptions to the apparent rule that censors anything starting c - o - c - k with zero or more trailing letters (not sure if anything with those letters in the middle is also censored, such as stopcock). Using only a blacklist means that someone will have to list all the undesired combinations of the rude word and other additions.

Ah, so my experiment shows we may safely discuss plumbing, or badminton, or things that show which way the wind blows...

_________________
KI numbers:
11981 AlanD
12305 AlanDJ


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2015 4:06 pm 
Offline
Former MystOnline Moderator

Joined: Fri Nov 10, 2006 3:05 pm
Posts: 4202
Location: 56°2'26", -3°20'28"
That is what I was meaning about the preference for a whitelist or blacklist coming down to whichever seemed to require the fewest rules added. In this case it seems to me that "allow everything except these specific words..." becomes the simpler method (besides the fact that whitelisting is not available) as I can see fewer words I'd want to block than I'd want to allow. Other cases might be different.

And, yes, from what I could tell the rules currently applied are to substitute on word* only, not *word or *word* (all of which are options in the phpBB filters). I guess the expectation is that -s, -ed, -er, -ers, -ing are the most likely variants to try to catch.

_________________
Image Mac - MOULagain KI#00004826 00004289
In the interests of the environment, this post has been constructed entirely from recycled electrons.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 2015 8:36 pm 
Offline
Obduction Backer

Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2007 11:02 pm
Posts: 1479
Location: Hanging around with mermaids. And still looking for the elusive Funky Bahro.
I don't know if this helps, but we all know about spell-check programs, and I understand there are grammar programs as well.

Is it possible to have a grammar-check program that could detect the context of Certain Words, and would be able to tell the difference between Certain Body Parts and, say, a rooster or Richard's nickname?

_________________
New to Uru? See this video.

KI numbers:
TOOO 24657
Magical Mystery TOOO 643784
Institution TOOO 816645
Karaoke TOOO 816776

~and featuring~

Murinna (the mermaid) 2484723
Mallina (the other mermaid) 3015052

Second Life: TOOO Fall


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 2015 8:52 pm 
Offline
Former MystOnline Moderator

Joined: Fri Nov 10, 2006 3:05 pm
Posts: 4202
Location: 56°2'26", -3°20'28"
It's theoretically possible, but it doesn't currently exist as either part of the stock phpBB installation or as one of the developed plug-ins for it, so far as I can tell.

While it is possible, I'm wondering about how difficult it would be, in a practical sense, to set up the rules for what cases you want to allow or disallow - how could you express it terms of IFs, ANDs, ORs, etc. It would also probably need to multi-language aware, just to add to the complication.

_________________
Image Mac - MOULagain KI#00004826 00004289
In the interests of the environment, this post has been constructed entirely from recycled electrons.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 2015 10:19 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Sep 08, 2006 1:57 am
Posts: 1335
That's an interesting idea, TOOO. It's something I've often thought about because the performance of most grammar checkers isn't very good. How could these be improved? I think you'd have to write some sort of context-sensitive grammar analysis program to make it work, as there are so many ways to say things in English.

Even book publishers have problems. Now that authors routinely use spell check and grammar check, there are certain characteristic errors I see regularly in professionally published books.

What you really need is an expert system that contains the built-up wisdom of an experienced human proofreader. It needs to be able to flag problems but leave idiosyncrasy alone. It would probably cost more to develop than could be supported by all the Internet's forum users...

_________________
Want to learn more about the D'ni? Look here: http://www.dpwr.net/


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 2015 11:51 pm 
Offline
Obduction Backer

Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2007 6:14 pm
Posts: 4250
Location: Digging around in the dusty archives, uncovering Uru history.
You can't replace the good sense of a human with code. Even an AI capable of learning couldn't do as well as a human. People are finding ways to skirt the current system and they would find new ways to skirt a new system. IMO, it's a futile effort to have an automated system in place at all, but it's just not practical for Cyan to waste too much time patrolling these forums, so it's the best alternative, I guess.

It just feels like we're not being given the benefit of the doubt or a chance to prove we can behave ourselves. It doesn't matter that we're mostly grown ups here, mostly good people who don't feel a need to use words unsuitable for a family friendly forum. Or, that hurdles have been put in place to make it too much trouble for the passing troll to waste their time in signing up.

In any case, now that we can talk openly about God, I can live with the rest of the inconveniences posed by the automated system.

_________________
Explorers Memorial * In Memoriam


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 53 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4

All times are UTC


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: SEMrush [Bot] and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron