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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 12:11 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 06, 2006 5:58 am
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Location: Australia
UPDATE 1st April: Most information in the latter half of this post is now obsolete, however, I figured it was easier to keep the same thread as it measn all chat logs would be in the same place, and also there'd be less redundant threads lying around cluttering up the forum :P Having said this, continue to post any questions/thoughts/RSVPs/ whatever in this thread.

The Next meeting will also be in the RelayerCorps' Bevin, on April 5, 18:00 EDT, which is 15:00 PDT and 22:00 GMT/UTC. Items on the agenda will likely include:
- Guild Structure,
- Expansion of Guild assets,
- And continued improvements to existing services. All are invited to attend.



Ok, The GoMe is holding an upcoming meeting tomorrow, at 16:00, with the venue, TBA, We'll let you know here in the next couple of hours.

The subject of the meeting will simply be to 1. organise a more streamlined and 'outsider' friendly structure within the Guild for non-Messengers to interact with, 2. To more clearly explain current procedures that are in place for news dissemination for the benefit of the general public, and 3. Open clearer communications with other orgs, particularly the 4 other Guilds, plus any other prominent groups.

As such (We know its terribly late notice), but we think it would be awesome if reps from the GoW, the GoG, the GoC and the GoMa could attend, plus any other interested parties across the cavern. WE may hold another meeting at a later date for this purpose if it proves necessary, as a large chunk of the meeting will probably working out things within the GoMe itself.

Current attendees from the GoMe are myself, Marten, Shimmerillion, Lynuette and Szark (Itseye Mee).

Thank you for your time

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Last edited by Narym on Wed Apr 02, 2008 12:05 am, edited 3 times in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 12:50 am 

Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2006 6:00 pm
Posts: 4095
Here is the copy of a suggestion I have made on the Relayer Corps forums.
(Crier)_Nanouk wrote:
re: Communication process with other Guilds


From my adventures in the game and on the MOUL's forums, I came to the conclusion
that there seems to be a communication problem with other Guilds.

My suggestion, to clear away the fog, would be to give a user friendly procedure to get
the news to be distributed in the game.
(This would be a second option added to your old ways... :lol:

I would make a GoME new forum with clear instructions about the procedure.
Submit your news (Forum title)

Sub threads subjects
#1- submit yours news
#2- edited for approval (by official GoMe's editor(s))
#3- Approved/final. (response from the person who made the submission)

Emails or PMs should only be used as a last resort, in case of emergencies.

I would also make certain that these instructions are posted in The Guilds Forum on MOUL.

Each Guild should have an official Rep on the GoMe forums or
if it is too much to ask, an official GoMe's Rep should be assigned to
each of the Guilds forums.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 3:55 am 
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Joined: Mon May 15, 2006 10:02 pm
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The Guild Meeting will be occurring in the Relayer Corps' Neighborhood.

Artic, good suggestions. I believe several of GoMe members have already come to a similar conclusion. Whether each GoMe liaison for another guild will come from within the GoMe, or from the other guild, is undetermined; that may be chosen on a per-guild basis.

Clearing up our guild structure and making clearer how to work with/contact the GoMe are also top concerns (from my perspective).

MOULa KI: 26838 | Prologue Videos | Visit to explore Myst, Uru, and D'ni communities!
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 4:26 am 
Obduction Backer

Joined: Fri Nov 17, 2006 3:17 am
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Location: Hilo, I wish...
A week or so ago I responded to a thread of (I think) mostly Guild of Maintainer concerns - I don't remember which thread it was, unfortunately. I volunteered for what I thought was a news scouting need, and Dot said "You're hired." But it looks like what they (GoMa) wanted is actually a liaison with the Guild of Messengers. I said I would have to talk to the Messengers to find out if there was already somebody serving that role because I've been only peripherally involved through working as a Relayer and I haven't followed GoMe development closely. (You can only keep track of so much. :? )

I hadn't yet followed up with GoMe (both parents in hospital, long story), but it looks like now's the time! I'm certainly willing to undertake this role, if there is a need. I would have to get up to speed with both guilds, which I haven't really had the time to do this last week. However, if GoMe already has a liaison structure in place and somebody in that role, no problem. I just wanted to let you know I'm willing - if somebody can provide a clear job description.

The immediate problem is that I will be on the SL field trip tomorrow at the time of the meeting, so I can't really be in the Cavern. What I could do is log on to MOUL with my laptop (which just barely runs the game; half the time I can't even see other avatars), and try to log/monitor the proceedings.

Anyway, I just wanted to let you know I would be happy to serve as liaison between Messengers and Maintainers, if needed and if it's not already covered. :)

Explorer at large


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 4:58 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 06, 2006 5:58 am
Posts: 256
Location: Australia
If, for startters, you could contact the GoMa asap and inform someone there directly of this meeting, and get a rep from them to come, that would be good enough.

Thanks Kerryth! :D

Complete 15 issue archive of The Archiver, published by The Cavern Today, 2006-08

Old MOUL KI: 13986530
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 5:50 am 

Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2006 6:00 pm
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Just to make things clear, if we (GoMe) have to make a move, I would suggest
a different Rep for each Guild. (less fooling around and less work).

The Rep could have a special thread (or a special forum with my three threads as mentionned above)
into which a guild would submit their news.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 5:51 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 06, 2006 5:58 am
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Location: Australia
Yeah, you're right. It's simpler that way. I think that was how we were going to work it, in any case.

But that's what meetings are for, right? Working things out :P

Complete 15 issue archive of The Archiver, published by The Cavern Today, 2006-08

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 5:55 am 

Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2006 6:00 pm
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Narym wrote:
Yeah, you're right. It's simpler that way. I think that was how we were going to work it, in any case.

But that's what meetings are for, right? Working things out :P

Better be ready than sorry. Image

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 6:01 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 06, 2006 5:58 am
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Location: Australia
lol got that right :P

Are you going to be appearing at the meeting itself, AW?

Complete 15 issue archive of The Archiver, published by The Cavern Today, 2006-08

Old MOUL KI: 13986530
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 6:06 am 

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Narym wrote:
lol got that right :P

Are you going to be appearing at the meeting itself, AW?

Unless I get stuck in tomorrow's snow storm, I should be
present as...

(Crier)_Nanouk, KI # 13469725

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 6:12 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 06, 2006 5:58 am
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Awesome!! :D

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 9:05 am 

Joined: Fri Jan 12, 2007 11:52 am
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Kerryth wrote:
A week or so ago I responded to a thread of (I think) mostly Guild of Maintainer concerns - I don't remember which thread it was, unfortunately. I volunteered for what I thought was a news scouting need, and Dot said "You're hired." But it looks like what they (GoMa) wanted is actually a liaison with the Guild of Messengers. ...

Anyway, I just wanted to let you know I would be happy to serve as liaison between Messengers and Maintainers, if needed and if it's not already covered. :)

Yes please, Kerryth! There's a lot going on in the Guild of Maintainers: explorer-made age inspections, bug reports, puzzle hints and spoilers; discussing a bug-tracking system with the GoW; a team writing an age for the Rapid Age Development competition; a separate team of judges from GoMa and GoW being organised for the same competition; setting up a GoMa outpost in There; ongoing work on the Great Zero project... We're so busy with these things, it's hard to fit in time to let others know what's happening. So your services will be much appreciated!

I've posted a link to this thread on the GoMa forum asking for volunteers to attend the meeting. I'm afraid it starts a bit too late for me. (Szark, I admire your dedication here -- 1 am GMT!)

PS to Kerryth: Sorry to hear about your parents both being in hospital -- a worrying time for you. Hope it works out OK.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 9:30 am 

Joined: Tue May 30, 2006 7:51 pm
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Location: Rotterdam, NL
If i'm still awake (& done with the SL-tour) i will attend with my crier-avi blu'nana KI# 13237710
but don't count on me, for i'm a terrible sleepy person at night ;)

KI# 192 002
KI# 9198538

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 11:03 am 

Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2007 9:11 pm
Posts: 659
Location: UK
I'm afraid it starts a bit too late for me. (Szark, I admire your dedication here -- 1 am GMT!)
You know Dot I hadn't noticed. I saw this thread late last night and thought ohhh meeting and assumed that it would be at the same time as the last one 14.00 KI , silly me for assuming. I still get a liitle confused when converting KI in GMT. Bring on the match sticks.
Marten and Narym I will try to make it.
Take care
Just to Add 16.00KI is 11.00pm GMT I nearly missed it. I now have a clock on my sidebar with MST time on it.

Last edited by Szark on Sun Mar 02, 2008 11:10 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 1:16 am 
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A log of the meeting, for all interested.

(03/01 18:04:49) Alderem: According to my KI, it is 16:00.
(03/01 18:05:09) Relayer Corps: mine too
(03/01 18:05:10) (Crier)_Nanouk: yep
(03/01 18:05:22) _Narym_: yeah, Marten and Szark are on the GoMe forums, so I just wanna give them a sec and see if they actually are coming
(03/01 18:05:24) Relayer Corps: so who is running this show?
(03/01 18:05:27) Alderem: Everyone, you know me as Marten; that avvie is on ice for now, at least until the 4th.
(03/01 18:05:34) Alderem: of April
(03/01 18:05:37) Nadnerb: ohhh
(03/01 18:05:38) Alderem: We'll see what happens beyond then.
(03/01 18:05:42) Nadnerb: hey then marten. :D
(03/01 18:05:50) Relayer Corps: Hi Marten
(03/01 18:05:50) _Narym_: lol woops
(03/01 18:05:52) _Narym_: my bad
(03/01 18:05:56) Relayer Corps roars with laughter
(03/01 18:05:59) _Narym_: hello MArten :P
(03/01 18:06:02) _Narym_ waves hello
(03/01 18:06:21) _Narym_: yay, I look like a complete twad now!!!
(03/01 18:06:23) Alderem: Szark mentioned on the GoMe forum that he did not realize the meeting would be at 1600, he thought it would be at 1400 which is late for him.
(03/01 18:06:35) Alderem: No, I look like a twad for not informing you sooner!
(03/01 18:06:42) (Crier)_Nanouk: You should be aware I am Artic_Wagon on MOUL's forums
(03/01 18:06:43) Relayer Corps nods her head
(03/01 18:06:50) Shimmerillion: lol we thought you were just a stalker
(03/01 18:06:58) Shimmerillion: a gome groupie, rather ;)
(03/01 18:07:02) Relayer Corps: lol
(03/01 18:07:04) _Narym_: so...
(03/01 18:07:16) _Narym_: anyone else have any important alter egos we should be aware of?
(03/01 18:07:24) Nadnerb is Nadnerb
(03/01 18:07:25) Alderem: Shimmer, I have list of topic areas, and information that Blade sent me in PM. I can drop that in your mailbox really quick if you prefer to run the meeting.
(03/01 18:07:25) Shimmerillion: i am actually rand
(03/01 18:07:38) Relayer Corps: Shimmer!!!
(03/01 18:07:40) Shimmerillion: marten, i have no pref
(03/01 18:07:42) Shimmerillion: LOL what if i was
(03/01 18:07:45) Relayer Corps: That's blashemy!
(03/01 18:07:52) (Crier)_Nanouk: I feel like that anyway due to my lack of
(03/01 18:07:59) Relayer Corps: blasphemy
(03/01 18:08:15) _Narym_: ok, well, let's start then, I guess
(03/01 18:08:17) Relayer Corps: I'm Lynnuttte on the forums
(03/01 18:08:26) Relayer Corps: in case no one knew
(03/01 18:08:39) (Crier)_Nanouk: that is
(03/01 18:09:00) Nadnerb: well, I've relayed the important stuff. >.>
(03/01 18:09:31) Nadnerb whacks KI with iron fist
(03/01 18:09:36) Nadnerb: so, are we starting?
(03/01 18:09:40) _Narym_: yeah
(03/01 18:09:41) Shimmerillion: yes let's do
(03/01 18:09:55) Alderem: Alright, Narym, your agenda looks quite similar to mine :) Good
(03/01 18:09:57) _Narym_: Ok, so first off, Welcome :)
(03/01 18:10:10) _Narym_: Do we have reps from the other Guilds here?
(03/01 18:10:32) Para Dox: I'm Councilor of Public Relations with the GoW
(03/01 18:10:50) _Narym_ waves to PAra
(03/01 18:10:53) _Narym_ waves hello
(03/01 18:10:59) _Narym_: any others?
(03/01 18:11:03) Relayer Corps: Glad to have someone from the GOW here
(03/01 18:11:15) (Crier)_Nanouk: welcome Councilor
(03/01 18:11:19) _Narym_: I think Kerryth was going to be it for the Maintainers
(03/01 18:11:22) Nadnerb is from the GoW as well. He's just here to watch though.
(03/01 18:11:35) _Narym_: And we haven't heard anything from the GoG and the GoC
(03/01 18:11:49) Relayer Corps: I'm from the GOG too nadnerb, but I can't represent them
(03/01 18:12:08) _Narym_: so this might be it for Guilds reps
(03/01 18:12:13) Shimmerillion: i never knew that. good for you L
(03/01 18:12:16) _Narym_: But that's cool, we've still got plenty to do
(03/01 18:12:17) Relayer Corps: looks that way
(03/01 18:12:33) Relayer Corps: unless you want me to go to the GOG hood and ask them if they want to send a rep.
(03/01 18:12:35) Nadnerb does not pretend that anyone represents anyone else.. but accepts that they have an idea of the group.
(03/01 18:12:47) _Narym_: lol if you think it would be worthwhile?
(03/01 18:12:55) Relayer Corps: probably not
(03/01 18:12:56) Shimmerillion: i have to leave at 6 ish
(03/01 18:13:05) Relayer Corps: most likely no guild leader will be there
(03/01 18:13:33) Alderem: OK. Well, Shimmer, Narym and I have agreed to ask you to discuss first our news submission system as it currently exists.
(03/01 18:13:33) Shimmerillion: 17:00ish that is
(03/01 18:13:45) (Crier)_Nanouk: I love that king of cooperation
(03/01 18:13:54) _Narym_: lol
(03/01 18:13:54) Shimmerillion: ok well it is currently a form that shoots to a database
(03/01 18:14:07) Shimmerillion: actually 2 forms, though i'm beginning to think one might be more expedient
(03/01 18:14:26) Shimmerillion: the feed is generated through PHP, pulling the latest database entries
(03/01 18:14:42) Relayer Corps: will it make it so I can keep posting on the RSS feeed?
(03/01 18:14:54) Relayer Corps: the one we have now hates me
(03/01 18:14:56) Shimmerillion: i have been looking at creating a master feed from our website feed as well as the affiliate RSS feeds or whoever else
(03/01 18:15:14) Shimmerillion: Lynnutte, the last time it was your browser caching old versions. i can't do anything about that
(03/01 18:15:25) Relayer Corps: oh yeah. my bad
(03/01 18:15:27) Nadnerb: hmm..
(03/01 18:15:28) Shimmerillion: lol
(03/01 18:15:30) Itiseye Mee waves hello
(03/01 18:15:31) Alderem: Welcome Szark, I thought it was going to be too late at night for you :)
(03/01 18:15:42) Relayer Corps hangs her head in embarrassment
(03/01 18:15:45) Itiseye Mee: shorah all
(03/01 18:15:49) Nadnerb: Szark? >.>
(03/01 18:15:52) Itiseye Mee: sorry I am late
(03/01 18:15:52) Relayer Corps: Shorah
(03/01 18:15:56) Shimmerillion: welcome
(03/01 18:16:00) Ghame: Shorah
(03/01 18:16:05) (Crier)_Nanouk: shorah
(03/01 18:16:06) _Narym_: so, continue Shimmer :)
(03/01 18:16:33) Shimmerillion: so anyway, the only bug left is that i might have to add some extra tags to the php-generated feed to make it play nicely with all the regular feeds
(03/01 18:16:51) Shimmerillion: this is so they display in order of publication
(03/01 18:17:02) Alderem: If you can incorporate automatic escaping of = signs so we don't have to use tinyurl, that'd be nice. There must be a mod for it somewhere.
(03/01 18:17:03) Shimmerillion: after i get that worked out, i should be able to swap them out
(03/01 18:17:11) Shimmerillion: and put the combined feed on the site
(03/01 18:17:16) _Narym_: Ok
(03/01 18:17:46) Shimmerillion: marten, i'll look into it but the first version probably won't have that feature
(03/01 18:17:51) Shimmerillion: for time's sake
(03/01 18:17:57) Alderem: Boy, do I understand that.
(03/01 18:18:23) Shimmerillion: oh, and i did change the verbage on the submission pages
(03/01 18:18:35) Shimmerillion: (shift-refresh if you still see the old verbage in IE)
(03/01 18:18:57) Shimmerillion: and if you guys think we need any changes to the Terms of Service, please let me know. i just made up some stuff
(03/01 18:19:01) _Narym_: cool
(03/01 18:19:03) _Narym_: yeah
(03/01 18:19:22) _Narym_: so how can the explorer community currently use the news submission service?
(03/01 18:19:26) Alderem: Yes. For those who weren't aware, the original text on the submit page had alarmed some people. Shimmer put a lot of thought into revising that. Please, do check those if you had objections previously and let us know if it is clearer now.
(03/01 18:19:42) Shimmerillion: well, all they have to do is fill out a form
(03/01 18:19:59) Shimmerillion: i can make a big button for it on the main page if that might help
(03/01 18:20:01) Shimmerillion: ?
(03/01 18:20:09) Itiseye Mee nods his head
(03/01 18:20:22) _Narym_: As in, bigger than the big 'submit' one that's already there?
(03/01 18:20:23) Alderem: I think it's pretty obvious on the page already, but continue please. An account is not necessary to submit news, correct?
(03/01 18:20:23) Relayer Corps: big button for those who can't see little buttons
(03/01 18:20:29) Shimmerillion: correct
(03/01 18:20:40) _Narym_: and the news is posted directly to the feed?
(03/01 18:20:51) Shimmerillion: narym, that is also correct
(03/01 18:21:06) (Crier)_Nanouk: I have no isea what you are talking about, so it must be
(03/01 18:21:13) Shimmerillion: since the combined feed will not utilize the icons, i am thinking about doing away with the login submission form altogether
(03/01 18:21:31) Alderem: Bear in mind, if we find someone using this feed for spam, we will take actions. But for now, you do not need an account, and distribution to the RSS feed is automatic.
(03/01 18:21:37) Relayer Corps: I think that's a good idea
(03/01 18:21:39) Shimmerillion: i guess i'd still have to leave it up for lynnutte and i to edit/delete posts
(03/01 18:21:39) _Narym_: Crier, go to
(03/01 18:21:47) _Narym_: I think redirects there
(03/01 18:22:11) Para Dox: I seems to recall that the news system stripped a lot of the formatting
(03/01 18:22:19) _Narym_: and you'll see what were talking about :P
(03/01 18:22:26) (Crier)_Nanouk: ok
(03/01 18:22:32) Shimmerillion: para dox, could you be more specific?
(03/01 18:23:00) Para Dox: In the original GoW Newsletter, I had listed all of the councilors on separate lines along with their positions
(03/01 18:23:04) Shimmerillion: ohhh
(03/01 18:23:25) Para Dox: When I submitted it, they were all on the same line and it was difficult to distinguish between them
(03/01 18:23:29) Shimmerillion: yeah it is currently a text entry, not a WSIWYG (what you see is what you get) entry form
(03/01 18:23:49) _Narym_: is that something that can be changed, Shimmer?
(03/01 18:23:58) Shimmerillion: i know this is important, so it is on my list. however, i do not want to overpromise how fast i can get a wsiwyg incorporated
(03/01 18:24:03) Para Dox: Shouldn't that still maintain line-break characters?
(03/01 18:24:07) Alderem: There are codes though, right? I see bulleted items on some of the Feed contents now.
(03/01 18:24:12) Nadnerb: Dox > no...
(03/01 18:24:17) Shimmerillion: nope, it does read html though
(03/01 18:24:21) Nadnerb: I would assmue it's just dropped in as html
(03/01 18:24:26) Nadnerb: html requires

(03/01 18:24:28) Shimmerillion: so if you put
it will read that as a line break
(03/01 18:24:31) Nadnerb: actual line breaks don't do wanything.
(03/01 18:24:37) Para Dox: Ah okay, so
is a workaround then
(03/01 18:24:42) Nadnerb nods his head
(03/01 18:24:46) Alderem: Alright. Unless we can find a way to maintain carriage returns from text entry, we should update the submit notice to indicate that HTML should be used.
(03/01 18:24:53) Shimmerillion: ok
(03/01 18:24:54) _Narym_: yeah
(03/01 18:24:55) Nadnerb: definitely
(03/01 18:24:55) Relayer Corps: let me know when you start talking in a language I can understand. lol
(03/01 18:24:58) Alderem: Good feedback!
(03/01 18:25:12) Alderem: RC, let me try...
(03/01 18:25:20) _Narym_: and maybe even a quick faq where the basic commands are listed for the less technically able :P
(03/01 18:25:20) Relayer Corps: ok?
(03/01 18:25:20) Para Dox: Marten > Except that you don't want <blink> and <marquee> tags suddenly appearing in your feeds
(03/01 18:25:30) Para Dox: (and the rest of the community does want them either)
(03/01 18:25:37) Shimmerillion: yes, that is good feedback. the first newsposts were not that long, so it didn't occur to us to worry about formatting
(03/01 18:25:43) Itiseye Mee: For peps like Mee Naryn
(03/01 18:25:49) _Narym_: lol
(03/01 18:25:52) Shimmerillion: lol
(03/01 18:25:52) Nadnerb: Dox > well, it's been possible all this time...
(03/01 18:26:01) Nadnerb: so I wouldn't expect it to immediately be a problem
(03/01 18:26:04) _Narym_: but yeah, a faq for formatting should be rather simple to make
(03/01 18:26:14) Alderem: RSS is a technology for distributing information... An RSS feed can be added to your web browser so news articles appear like bookmarks, or it can be automatically incorporated into other websites.
(03/01 18:26:37) Itiseye Mee nods his head
(03/01 18:26:40) Relayer Corps: I know what an Rss feed is. I was talking about the programming one part. lol
(03/01 18:26:52) _Narym_: yeah, we can put that into a faq
(03/01 18:26:55) Shimmerillion: yup
(03/01 18:26:58) Para Dox: Nad > but if they state that HTML can be used for formatting...
(03/01 18:27:06) _Narym_: it may take too long to do now, when its something we can just do later
(03/01 18:27:31) _Narym_: Dox, we can always just list specific commands, instead of just saying html in its entirety
(03/01 18:27:39) Para Dox: That should work
(03/01 18:27:51) Shimmerillion: narym, that is a good idea
(03/01 18:27:52) Alderem: Alright. Anyway, we'll take the suggestion about formatting and do something about it. We'll return to the topic of news feeds again later to discuss the community-wide aspects.
(03/01 18:27:58) _Narym_: yes
(03/01 18:28:04) _Narym_: moving along... :P
(03/01 18:28:12) Relayer Corps: lol
(03/01 18:28:34) Alderem: The GoMe also started a periodic newsletter, of as yet undetermined period.
(03/01 18:28:51) Relayer Corps nods her head
(03/01 18:29:14) Alderem: There was a poll to ask people how frequently we should mail that out. The newsletter will incorporate still-relevant news from the feed as well as other information the GoMe becomes aware of, of interest to the community.
(03/01 18:29:25) Alderem: Does anyone have the results of that poll?
(03/01 18:29:33) _Narym_: where was it posted?
(03/01 18:29:34) Relayer Corps: Yes
(03/01 18:29:37) Alderem: MOUL forums.
(03/01 18:29:40) Itiseye Mee: MOUL
(03/01 18:30:23) Relayer Corps: The general concensus was one a month or when there was something important to report
(03/01 18:30:52) _Narym_: ok
(03/01 18:30:57) _Narym_: well that's definitely doable
(03/01 18:30:57) (Crier)_Nanouk: ok
(03/01 18:31:02) Relayer Corps: Important meaning URU is back up and running or permanently scrapped or the Shards are opening
(03/01 18:31:06) Shimmerillion: lol
(03/01 18:31:06) Itiseye Mee: Thats about right imo
(03/01 18:31:14) Alderem: Which person specifically is running the newsletter, is that you, rC?
(03/01 18:31:19) Relayer Corps: yes
(03/01 18:31:21) Relayer Corps: for now
(03/01 18:31:23) Thumbs up from Alderem
(03/01 18:31:29) Alderem: Alright :)
(03/01 18:31:48) Relayer Corps: I'm looking for help with the newsletter
(03/01 18:32:04) _Narym_: what's the format of the newsletter, atm?
(03/01 18:32:05) Relayer Corps: I have some RL issues going on right now, but this newsletter is important
(03/01 18:32:14) (Crier)_Nanouk: Have not received anything yet
(03/01 18:32:25) Relayer Corps: Really, right now it's free form
(03/01 18:32:25) _Narym_: shorah anthony
(03/01 18:32:35) Alderem: The first newsletter went out on February 9. So we're not due for the second one just yet.
(03/01 18:32:44) Itiseye Mee waves hello
(03/01 18:32:44) _Narym_: is it actually in the e-mail. or is it distributed by attachment?
(03/01 18:32:48) Shimmerillion: we had talked about doing an HTML email, but i also thought about throwing together something in publisher real fast
(03/01 18:32:48) (Crier)_Nanouk: ok
(03/01 18:32:51) Relayer Corps: We should have the next out sometime this week
(03/01 18:32:56) Alderem: What can we do to help, RC? Submit information to you for consideration? Piece one together on the forums?
(03/01 18:32:58) Itiseye Mee: shaorah Anthony
(03/01 18:32:59) Relayer Corps: as soon as I have time to do it
(03/01 18:33:04) Anthony: Hello
(03/01 18:33:10) Ghame: Shorah
(03/01 18:33:12) Relayer Corps: Yes and Yes
(03/01 18:33:31) Relayer Corps: write up short exerps and links to the info
(03/01 18:34:04) _Narym_: Should we have a thread/subforum on the GoMe forums for this purpose?
(03/01 18:34:15) Shimmerillion: or rather, if you think a particular story is important to include, tell us the title or itemID and we can just lift the text from the original post
(03/01 18:34:16) (Crier)_Nanouk: yes
(03/01 18:34:29) Relayer Corps: That's might not be a bad idea Narym
(03/01 18:34:43) Relayer Corps: That too Shimmer
(03/01 18:34:51) Alderem: I think those are both good ideas. I think people will prefer if we include original text, and it's easier.
(03/01 18:35:00) Shimmerillion: easier is my middle name
(03/01 18:35:04) Relayer Corps: I just want enough info in the article to make people want to learn more on their own
(03/01 18:35:13) (Crier)_Nanouk: simpler is best for all
(03/01 18:35:19) Relayer Corps nods her head
(03/01 18:36:01) Alderem: OK, sounds good. Any more comments on the newsletter? Did anyone who received the first one have suggestions?
(03/01 18:36:11) Relayer Corps: having one place for me to find all the info on the articles will make writting the newsletter alot easier
(03/01 18:36:20) Relayer Corps: or suggestions
(03/01 18:36:37) Relayer Corps: sorry. I read that as comments
(03/01 18:36:40) _Narym_: yeah, well, if he have a central sub forum, you can have that place
(03/01 18:36:46) Shimmerillion: i just made one
(03/01 18:36:52) _Narym_: or we can just dump it into your email inbox, if you prefer :P
(03/01 18:36:56) Relayer Corps: Ty shimmer!
(03/01 18:37:01) (Crier)_Nanouk: I have made a suggestion on Relayer and Guilds/MOUL forums
(03/01 18:37:10) Alderem: Let's hear it
(03/01 18:37:32) Relayer Corps: ty Nanouk I will look at it
(03/01 18:37:51) Relayer Corps: sorry, I see to be lagging in the conversation
(03/01 18:38:00) Relayer Corps: please, tell us Nanouk
(03/01 18:38:03) (Crier)_Nanouk: too long for me, go to MOUL/GoMe forum for infos
(03/01 18:38:09) _Narym_: one question I had withs suggestion
(03/01 18:38:11) Alderem: OK. We'll read it there then.
(03/01 18:38:17) Relayer Corps: yes?
(03/01 18:38:39) _Narym_: @nanouk was it purely regarding in cavern news dissemination, or was it just news from the GoMe in general
(03/01 18:38:56) _Narym_: the suggestion in question is in the thread for this meeting on MOUL
(03/01 18:39:12) (Crier)_Nanouk: communications between Guilds
(03/01 18:39:19) _Narym_: ah, ok
(03/01 18:39:25) Alderem: Thank you Nanouk.
(03/01 18:39:39) _Narym_: Well, we will be addressing that later on I think...
(03/01 18:39:40) (Crier)_Nanouk: just a noob idea
(03/01 18:39:56) Relayer Corps: noob ideas can be some of the best
(03/01 18:40:03) Relayer Corps: fresh eyes and all
(03/01 18:40:08) Alderem: We are definitely going to cover that topic in just a bit.
(03/01 18:40:15) _Narym_: Yeah, we'll leave your suggestion for now Nanouk
(03/01 18:40:16) (Crier)_Nanouk: ok
(03/01 18:41:07) Shimmerillion: so whats next
(03/01 18:41:12) Alderem: Nanouk, You also had a suggestion about better organizing the news submission forum, for those who want to post news w/o putting it directly on the RSS feed?
(03/01 18:41:41) (Crier)_Nanouk: yes for using forums
(03/01 18:41:50) Relayer Corps: I'm sorry everyone. I have to leave. I'll see you later and look at the log once it's posted.
(03/01 18:41:56) (Crier)_Nanouk: a new specific one
(03/01 18:42:01) Shimmerillion: ok thanks for coming lynnutte
(03/01 18:42:03) Relayer Corps waves goodbye
(03/01 18:42:05) Itiseye Mee: bye RC
(03/01 18:42:08) Shimmerillion waves goodbye
(03/01 18:42:15) (Crier)_Nanouk: bye RC
(03/01 18:42:30) _Narym_: woops
(03/01 18:42:34) _Narym_: see you lynnutte
(03/01 18:42:36) Alderem: Alright. I think that's a good suggestion as well. I think we can use the same area for the newsletter that shimmer just created for that as wel, does that make sense, shimmer?
(03/01 18:42:55) Shimmerillion: actually i think it might be better to put it in visitors
(03/01 18:43:05) Shimmerillion: right now the newsletter thing is in guild business
(03/01 18:43:16) Shimmerillion: but i can make a new section for it
(03/01 18:43:23) _Narym_: couldn't they just use the newsbin?
(03/01 18:43:36) Shimmerillion: yeah that's what the intent was ... but i can certainly make another
(03/01 18:43:46) Alderem: Oh!
(03/01 18:43:50) _Narym_: ok, whatever's easy to access and mod
(03/01 18:43:58) Alderem: Maybe the problem is that it just isn't clear that's what Newsbin is for.
(03/01 18:43:58) (Crier)_Nanouk: read my suggestion and decide
(03/01 18:44:13) Alderem: OK. let's table this topic for now; i think we can sort it out on the forum.
(03/01 18:44:35) (Crier)_Nanouk: will support your choice
(03/01 18:44:36) Para Dox: Just FYI, I've just posted the latest GoW Newsletter. The HTML worked perfectly :)
(03/01 18:45:04) Itiseye Mee cheers
(03/01 18:45:06) _Narym_: yay!
(03/01 18:45:08) Alderem: Very good!
(03/01 18:45:19) Alderem: I'm going to quickly detail the next few topics.
(03/01 18:45:42) Shimmerillion: great, para dox! :)
(03/01 18:46:20) Alderem: There's, Liaisons, What we can do with Liaisons, and Guild Structure
(03/01 18:46:40) Alderem: Oh, and Website improvement, skipped that by accident.
(03/01 18:46:48) Shimmerillion: can i put in my 2 cents about guild structure real fast? (not sure if we'll get to it before i have to go)
(03/01 18:47:00) _Narym_: yep, if its quick :P
(03/01 18:47:07) Alderem: Okay.
(03/01 18:48:01) Shimmerillion: all i was going to say is that
(03/01 18:48:18) Shimmerillion: in the beginning, kalypso, lynnutte and i were doing a lot of the guild-proper stuff
(03/01 18:48:40) Shimmerillion: but kalypso is gone, as you know, and RL has gotten considerably more hectic for both lynnutte and i
(03/01 18:49:03) Shimmerillion: so while we are happy to keep doing as much as we can, i do think it is time we made some "real" job titles and stuff
(03/01 18:49:15) Shimmerillion: because i don't want people to get frustrated
(03/01 18:49:22) _Narym_: Yes
(03/01 18:49:25) Alderem nods his head
(03/01 18:49:35) Shimmerillion: and if there are others who have more time, i think it is appropriate to give them stuff to do! lol
(03/01 18:49:41) Shimmerillion: so that's all
(03/01 18:50:02) _Narym_: And if and when we get new people (We'll have to talk about job advertising aswell), we'll probably divide the workload in the more work heavy jobs
(03/01 18:50:03) Itiseye Mee: when skills allow
(03/01 18:50:11) _Narym_: Delegating is fun!! :D
(03/01 18:50:27) _Narym_: point taken, Szark
(03/01 18:50:31) (Crier)_Nanouk: that does fit with my earlier suggestion
(03/01 18:50:46) Alderem: Delegation is essential... as is credit to those who are involved.
(03/01 18:51:09) Itiseye Mee: I am not a leader just a doer
(03/01 18:51:24) Alderem: Shimmer, you're also our webmaster, right?
(03/01 18:51:33) Shimmerillion: well yeah delegation but also true leadership positions. i don't want this to stagnate just because lynnutte and i are swamped
(03/01 18:51:40) Shimmerillion: yup
(03/01 18:51:50) Alderem nods his head
(03/01 18:51:54) Shimmerillion: that's actually all i signed up to do in the first place :P
(03/01 18:51:57) Alderem: :)
(03/01 18:52:04) _Narym_: lol
(03/01 18:52:12) _Narym_: isn't that always the way
(03/01 18:52:17) Shimmerillion: lol
(03/01 18:52:17) Alderem: A lot of times, the person who speaks up about something, gets the job of doing it.
(03/01 18:52:31) Shimmerillion: very true
(03/01 18:52:37) _Narym_: in any case....
(03/01 18:52:42) Shimmerillion: and we both like helping out, but ... well there you are. :)
(03/01 18:52:43) (Crier)_Nanouk: clear mandates are always good
(03/01 18:52:49) _Narym_: shall we progress onto the next topic?
(03/01 18:52:54) Shimmerillion: yeah
(03/01 18:52:54) Itiseye Mee nods his head
(03/01 18:52:57) Alderem: So, all I wanted to touch on here is that if you have suggestions for the website, please post them to the forum or direct them to shimmer; she's very busy though so don't expect miracles.
(03/01 18:53:13) Alderem: And I do mean constructive suggestions.
(03/01 18:53:19) Shimmerillion: actually, i'm going to make a feature request thread in guild business. please post there
(03/01 18:53:27) Shimmerillion: yes, agreed (!)
(03/01 18:53:31) _Narym_: good
(03/01 18:53:33) (Crier)_Nanouk: ok
(03/01 18:53:57) (Crier)_Nanouk: pretty good idea
(03/01 18:54:22) Alderem: I'm going to quickly breeze over a topic of my own, is a website that I'm hoping the messengers and community at large will find useful. Erik, Tweek, and I have been working on it since December.
(03/01 18:54:46) Alderem: is an index to the community. It also carries the RSS feed from the Guild of Messengers so you can pick up the latest news too.
(03/01 18:54:46) Itiseye Mee: very nice too
(03/01 18:55:31) Alderem: The future design of can be found if you go to , and I am seeking feedback on what would make it better. If you have suggestions, please let me know.
(03/01 18:56:08) Alderem: That includes sites that may not be listed, or you feel are miscategorized, as well as layout issues. No concern is too small.
(03/01 18:56:24) Alderem: That's all on that topic. I think we're ready to discuss liaisons.
(03/01 18:57:17) Alderem: I was hoping Lynnutte would still be here because in some ways, the liaison role maps a bit to the Relayers, or perhaps to the criers; liaisons are the human face of the GoMe seen by others.
(03/01 18:57:38) Alderem: The role of liaisons would include keeping up with their delegated or chosen parts of the community, and improving co-ordination between our groups.
(03/01 18:57:57) _Narym_ nods his head
(03/01 18:58:09) Shimmerillion nods her head
(03/01 18:58:16) Alderem: The Maintainers and the Writers have both asked for liaisons, and SuperGram expressed frustration that no official GoMe presence has been attending her parade organization meetings...
(03/01 18:58:26) Alderem: So there is a clear call from the community for this sort of role.
(03/01 18:58:31) Shimmerillion: hm
(03/01 18:58:41) Para Dox: indeed
(03/01 18:59:25) (Crier)_Nanouk: I am the english to french translater for Relayers
(03/01 18:59:56) Alderem: Right now, we are a pretty small group, and many of us have our hands full with assorted tasks. So, we may not always be able to provide our own liaisons to other groups. In some cases, we'll probably need the other groups to put forth a liaison.
(03/01 19:00:22) (Crier)_Nanouk: and will cover french forums
(03/01 19:00:22) _Narym_: this is true
(03/01 19:00:30) _Narym_: thanks, Nanouk
(03/01 19:00:41) Shimmerillion: but i guess we still need to tell these liasons who they should be in contact with?
(03/01 19:00:48) _Narym_: yes
(03/01 19:00:56) _Narym_: and also how this communication will actually take place
(03/01 19:00:58) Alderem: That is right; we need to define guild structure to make that clear.
(03/01 19:01:05) Shimmerillion: yes
(03/01 19:01:07) Alderem: (which is why that's one of the next topics)
(03/01 19:01:15) (Crier)_Nanouk: agree for other to provide a REP
(03/01 19:01:30) Shimmerillion: it might also be smart to have a MOUL liason, though
(03/01 19:01:42) Shimmerillion: someone from our side who reads MOUL forums a lot and can scan for news
(03/01 19:01:51) Shimmerillion: likewise with the other big forums
(03/01 19:02:22) Alderem: If the Writers prefer that the GoMe provide a liaison, one of us will step forward for that; I already have an account at the GoW and could dedicate some time each day to reading the news there. I also know Paradox can catch me on Cyanchat.
(03/01 19:02:41) Para Dox: What I'm looking for as Gow PR Rep is someone from GoMe that I can contact if I need to get information out
(03/01 19:03:15) Para Dox: I don't mind submitting the GoW newsletters manually (although I'm hoping to get an RSS feed for those)
(03/01 19:03:34) Shimmerillion: it seems to me that we just need one catch-all person for the other Guild PR people to talk to
(03/01 19:03:44) _Narym_: yeah
(03/01 19:03:51) _Narym_: One InterGuild Liaison
(03/01 19:03:55) Para Dox: but someone who could quickly check our calendar for meetings, and post those onto a GoMe calendar...
(03/01 19:03:56) Shimmerillion: like kalypso was doing ...
(03/01 19:04:01) Shimmerillion misses kalypso
(03/01 19:04:32) Alderem: Right now, the GoMe doesn't have its own calendar and uses the GoG one, but that's something I have as a topic to bring up a little later
(03/01 19:04:43) Shimmerillion: marten, actually we do have a calendar
(03/01 19:04:50) Alderem: We do?
(03/01 19:05:05) (Crier)_Nanouk: how about creating a thread on each Guild forums for them to communicate with us ?
(03/01 19:05:05) Shimmerillion: yes, we have been sharing events back and forth with the gog
(03/01 19:05:16) Shimmerillion: nanouk, that's a good idea
(03/01 19:05:51) Para Dox: I'm trying to make a list for future GoW PR people of who to contact from each of the other guilds
(03/01 19:06:04) Alderem: It seems like it would be easier for us to integrate onto one calendar.
(03/01 19:06:18) Para Dox: I know that MustardJeep is PR for the GoMa, but I have noone from GoC, GoG, or GoMe
(03/01 19:06:33) Shimmerillion: we can talk about the calendar later, let's finish this first
(03/01 19:06:40) (Crier)_Nanouk: always part of my early
(03/01 19:06:53) Alderem: If Shimmer thinks I'm up to the task, and if you also agree Paradox, I can be the contact person.
(03/01 19:07:03) Shimmerillion: i fully support that
(03/01 19:07:12) Para Dox: That's fine with me :)
(03/01 19:07:21) Shimmerillion: yay!
(03/01 19:07:29) _Narym_: lol
(03/01 19:07:35) (Crier)_Nanouk: yep, we are rolling now
(03/01 19:07:41) _Narym_: Marten, you are now the Official GoMe Liaison
(03/01 19:07:43) _Narym_: :D
(03/01 19:07:47) Alderem: For the GoW. :)
(03/01 19:07:48) _Narym_ salutes
(03/01 19:07:59) _Narym_: lol
(03/01 19:08:02) _Narym_: yes, my vad
(03/01 19:08:03) _Narym_: bad
(03/01 19:08:06) _Narym_: for the GoW
(03/01 19:08:26) (Crier)_Nanouk: do not forget to show a list on GoMe
(03/01 19:08:29) Shimmerillion: ah, rats. for a minute there i thought we'd convinced him to be GoMe Liason for everyoe
(03/01 19:08:36) _Narym_: yeah, me too
(03/01 19:08:41) Alderem: We'll work out other groups and such later. I do think we'll need a top liaison person, but it's something to sort out in our little job list.
(03/01 19:08:42) _Narym_: He's too smart for that, darn it
(03/01 19:08:45) Shimmerillion: lol
(03/01 19:08:53) _Narym_: yes
(03/01 19:08:55) Para Dox: Isn't Kerryth acting as Liaison to the GoMa?
(03/01 19:09:02) Alderem: Yes.
(03/01 19:09:03) _Narym_: Yeah
(03/01 19:09:25) _Narym_: Shimmer, can we add a page to the homepage with these people and their positions, contact details, etc?
(03/01 19:09:26) Shimmerillion: does kerryth need to go on the gome website also?
(03/01 19:09:30) Shimmerillion: absolutely
(03/01 19:09:33) _Narym_: I would say yes
(03/01 19:09:44) Alderem: We're going to need, I think, a sort of liaison committee, with one liaion for each major group, plus a leader liaison that anyone can go to if they don't have representation or if they have an issue with their liaison.
(03/01 19:09:57) _Narym_: yep
(03/01 19:10:00) Para Dox: That sounds good
(03/01 19:10:05) _Narym_: so a group of 5
(03/01 19:10:13) Alderem nods his head
(03/01 19:10:25) Para Dox: I definitely think that a stickied post on the forums, or better yet, a page on the website listing all of the liaisons would be a great idea
(03/01 19:10:28) (Crier)_Nanouk: wow, we are going somewhere
(03/01 19:10:40) _Narym_: yeah, shimmer said she could do that
(03/01 19:10:54) _Narym_: so that's done
(03/01 19:10:58) Shimmerillion: yes i think i am going to have to sit down and have an all-day coding session tomorrow
(03/01 19:10:58) Alderem: Doc, I think a lot of information - such as how to use the Newsbin, who are the liaisons, what is our guild structure - needs to go into one big FAQ sticked at the top of the forum.
(03/01 19:11:05) Shimmerillion: genius!
(03/01 19:11:08) Shimmerillion: good idea
(03/01 19:11:14) Para Dox: agreed
(03/01 19:11:23) _Narym_: I can put that together, if no one else wants to
(03/01 19:11:36) Shimmerillion: yes please
(03/01 19:11:36) Alderem: You just volunteered. You speak you get the job.
(03/01 19:11:42) _Narym_: yay!!!
(03/01 19:11:45) Shimmerillion: lol
(03/01 19:11:46) _Narym_: More work for me!!!
(03/01 19:11:55) Shimmerillion: NOW we're getting somewhere lol
(03/01 19:11:56) Itiseye Mee: Mee say nothing
(03/01 19:12:01) Shimmerillion roars with laughter
(03/01 19:12:17) _Narym_: Ok, well is there anything else related to liaisons that we need to address?
(03/01 19:12:29) Shimmerillion: narym, just send it to [email protected] when you finish
(03/01 19:12:40) _Narym_: k, np
(03/01 19:12:45) Alderem: I think we should move on to the next topic.
(03/01 19:12:50) _Narym_: Good idea.
(03/01 19:13:25) Alderem: Before we get into guild structure, I have a little list of suggestions and ideas... I want to present some of those because they tie into the structure idea.
(03/01 19:13:40) Itiseye Mee: ok
(03/01 19:13:41) _Narym_: Shoot.
(03/01 19:14:02) Shimmerillion: i have to leave soon, but i'll stay as long as i can
(03/01 19:14:21) Alderem: Blade Lakem had a lot of ideas, some which I may or may not agree with; I wanted to share those for mulling over.
(03/01 19:15:08) Alderem: Blade feels we need to be proactive, a strong guild. Other guilds already have "Definite ideas and plans", but the GoMe hasn't been as clear on theirs. He said, we should be the "first stop" for anything about Myst/Uru/D'ni
(03/01 19:15:21) Alderem: To accomplish that...
(03/01 19:15:56) Alderem: He felt we need to bring the affiliates closer into the GoMe, and focus less on personal affiliate projects.
(03/01 19:16:37) Alderem: He also mentioned that - although we do have that nifty news submission system - Uru's population isn't large enough for a self-sustaining website, updated entirely by the users. We must collect information from the community.
(03/01 19:17:14) Alderem: In other words, in a very large group, some are natural at reporting news and submitting it into the system. But Uru's community isn't large enough, so we have to do a little more work to collect news.
(03/01 19:18:06) Alderem: Blade suggested that guildmasters or leaders have an active vision, and organize guild-specific projects which may not neatly fall into one affiliate or another's domain. Relying on affiliates, he warned, will not work for every task.
(03/01 19:19:12) Alderem: He also suggested that we look into substituting for the defunct Assembly of Guilds, as an organization that provides the connectivity between the other guilds. He suggested we initiate features to cover the Uru community, stories about how Uru fits into other communities like SL and There, stories on Age Building, etc.
(03/01 19:19:47) Alderem: He proposed we talk to Thend about his Explorers Outside of Uru directory, and that we look into a solution for Lial's departure from updating the Calendar.
(03/01 19:20:02) Alderem: So... lots of ideas, thrown onto the table.
(03/01 19:20:52) Shimmerillion: i agree with most of that. my one concern is manpower
(03/01 19:21:04) Itiseye Mee: Shorah SD Raven
(03/01 19:21:17) skydiver Ravenraft: shorah all
(03/01 19:21:20) Alderem: Absolutely. We need to find people who will champion these ideas.
(03/01 19:21:22) Shimmerillion: welcome
(03/01 19:21:32) skydiver Ravenraft: ty
(03/01 19:21:33) (Crier)_Nanouk: agree with manpower bug
(03/01 19:21:43) Alderem: So, Blade's final comment was this...
(03/01 19:22:07) Alderem: We need to start by recruiting in people, looking at new affiliate groups, and motivating those groups to participate as part of the GoMe.
(03/01 19:22:41) Itiseye Mee: Most websites out there are no so busy with new information so news will be sketchy at best or doing anything new
(03/01 19:22:59) Alderem: So... when he suggests we subsitute for the AoG, that means going to the people who were in the AoG and talking to them. When he says look at Thend's directory, that means we should talk to Thend.
(03/01 19:23:12) Itiseye Mee: the only on going realy is GoW and GoMa
(03/01 19:23:21) Christopher910: hi
(03/01 19:23:25) Shimmerillion: right .. liason work
(03/01 19:23:30) (Crier)_Nanouk: need to send an invitation on
(03/01 19:23:33) Itiseye Mee: hiya Chris
(03/01 19:24:34) Shimmerillion: i mean, it would be great if we had a huge slew of reporters who combed through MOUL and the other forums, went and talked to people etc, and created real news reports
(03/01 19:24:48) (Crier)_Nanouk: invitation with very precise tasks
(03/01 19:24:50) Shimmerillion: i'm just not sure how we get to that point
(03/01 19:24:55) Itiseye Mee: AoG hasn't been used in months only by SAPS who have a new home
(03/01 19:25:05) Shimmerillion: nanouk, possibly
(03/01 19:25:06) Alderem: As I said, I don't necessarily agree with -every- thing Blade said. I think the affiliate system is pretty good. But I do think that with no specific delegation of responsibilities, tasks we'd like to accomplish won't get done.
(03/01 19:25:28) Shimmerillion: what is the status of all our affiliates? who is staying intact?
(03/01 19:25:47) Alderem: Narym and Anthony, you've been representing TCT, right?
(03/01 19:25:52) (Crier)_Nanouk: just call for free lancers news reporters
(03/01 19:26:05) Itiseye Mee: Advert
(03/01 19:26:14) _Narym_: ah...somewhat
(03/01 19:26:34) _Narym_: I've never really spoken for TCT at all
(03/01 19:26:35) Shimmerillion: nanouk and szark, yes, but what's the backup plan if we don't get any response?
(03/01 19:26:48) Christopher910: i hope more people would from SL to URU
(03/01 19:26:49) (Crier)_Nanouk: make it look as a good job offer
(03/01 19:26:49) _Narym_: Probably only ever spoken in regards to The Archiver
(03/01 19:27:20) Alderem: Rather than freelancers, I think we should talk to each group out there, and say "Hey there, we want you to know about what we can do for you", let each group know about the liaison they should talk to.
(03/01 19:27:39) Itiseye Mee: Good point shimmer have to think one that one
(03/01 19:27:56) Shimmerillion: hey, i really hate to have to leave now, but i have to run
(03/01 19:28:01) Shimmerillion: i will catch up on the log
(03/01 19:28:04) _Narym_: ok, np
(03/01 19:28:06) Itiseye Mee waves goodbye
(03/01 19:28:07) Nadnerb: ok, cya Shimmer
(03/01 19:28:07) Shimmerillion: thanks all!
(03/01 19:28:09) Nadnerb salutes
(03/01 19:28:10) Shimmerillion waves goodbye
(03/01 19:28:12) Alderem: Goodnight Shimmer
(03/01 19:28:14) _Narym_ waves goodbye
(03/01 19:28:16) (Crier)_Nanouk: all possibilities should be covered...;p;
(03/01 19:28:27) _Narym_: oooo, synchronised waving
(03/01 19:28:31) Alderem: Is Anthony asleep?
(03/01 19:28:38) Christopher910 waves goodbye
(03/01 19:28:47) _Narym_: poosibly
(03/01 19:28:48) StarbucksJim waves hello
(03/01 19:29:06) Itiseye Mee: Hiya Aterbuck
(03/01 19:29:09) Alderem: Well; I don't think we're going to build the structure of the guild in one night.
(03/01 19:29:16) Itiseye Mee: nope
(03/01 19:29:16) _Narym_: yeah, I think he's asleep
(03/01 19:29:27) Alderem: But, the impression I have is that most if not everyone here thinks it is a good idea.
(03/01 19:29:39) Itiseye Mee: agreed
(03/01 19:29:59) Alderem: Paradox, you had said that you would be willing to offer suggestions, based on the GoW's experiences in organizing?
(03/01 19:30:01) Itiseye Mee: Lets hope it pays off
(03/01 19:30:21) (Crier)_Nanouk: small steps by small steps>>>>>>big steps for the Community
(03/01 19:31:17) _Narym_: Para?
(03/01 19:31:47) Para Dox: uhm...
(03/01 19:31:49) Justin: watcha doin?
(03/01 19:32:01) Itiseye Mee: hiya Justin
(03/01 19:32:04) _Narym_: meeting
(03/01 19:32:05) Justin: Hi
(03/01 19:32:08) Alderem: Guild structure is the topic, you had offered suggestions/advising, is that right?
(03/01 19:32:14) Anthony: back
(03/01 19:32:14) Justin: i hope I"m not interupting somethign?
(03/01 19:32:20) Para Dox: Essentially, the GoW elections didn't really change the way that the GoW was run
(03/01 19:32:20) Justin: Is this something about the GoW?
(03/01 19:32:23) Justin: oOO
(03/01 19:32:24) Justin: Kewl
(03/01 19:32:25) (Crier)_Nanouk: looking for new news reporters
(03/01 19:32:27) Alderem: We are hopefully wrapping up the Guild of Messengers meeting.
(03/01 19:32:36) Justin: O, GoW
(03/01 19:32:37) Justin: Er M
(03/01 19:32:43) Para Dox: It just have a list of names of people who could be contacted
(03/01 19:33:14) Nadnerb: it basically just made figuring out who to talk to in the GoW less overwhelming for outsiders.
(03/01 19:33:20) Para Dox: It gave us some work to do (newsletters, meetings, etc.) but didn't really impact the overall guild
(03/01 19:33:30) (Crier)_Nanouk: does Justin want to volonteer as a news reporter ?
(03/01 19:33:37) Nadnerb: they could say.. "ok, this person is guild councilor of , I'll talk to them"
(03/01 19:33:47) Alderem: Ok. I want to express that we're willing to listen to your experiences in building your guild structure, how you elected people and such.
(03/01 19:33:52) Nadnerb: instead of wondering if they should post in a forum, or a subforum..
(03/01 19:33:53) _Narym_: Yeah
(03/01 19:34:12) Alderem: Nadnerb> Definitely.
(03/01 19:34:14) _Narym_: so we can have councillors of various media ie video, writing, sound
(03/01 19:34:15) Para Dox: To be honest, if I made a post stating that thought everyone should move to a different place, I'd likely be ignored
(03/01 19:34:28) _Narym_: as well as Chieft Editors, Webmasters, etc
(03/01 19:34:43) Para Dox: I really don't have any "power", and neither do any of the other councilors (aside from the ability to do forum maintenance)
(03/01 19:35:19) Para Dox: Our elections were pretty much three people got together, came up with a structure document, and then appointed someone for each position
(03/01 19:35:24) Nadnerb: as fo the "elections" basically some people came up with a list of nominees and held a series of polls to see if theyw would be accepted..
(03/01 19:35:34) Alderem: I think that's a key statement and something we could use as a model. One of the reasons we were averse to structure at the start was what was perceived to be a quick power grab.
(03/01 19:35:39) Para Dox: The election was mostly just a "do you accept the person who we've appointed"
(03/01 19:35:57) Alderem: People need to know that positions are about responsibility, not power.
(03/01 19:36:02) Para Dox: In the future, I'd like to see a nomination campaign
(03/01 19:36:06) Nadnerb: Which it turned out not to be.. , indeed.
(03/01 19:36:24) Para Dox: but to start with, take what you've got and change how you label it
(03/01 19:36:29) _Narym_: yeah
(03/01 19:36:30) Nadnerb: you just have to understand that you're people talking on a webforum. Realistically, you have no power over anyone else..
(03/01 19:36:50) Alderem nods his head
(03/01 19:36:53) Nadnerb: you're just setting up nice contacts and positions for everyone else..
(03/01 19:36:56) _Narym_: so work out the positions and their titles, then put it to the community for nominations, then elections, right PAra?
(03/01 19:37:09) (Crier)_Nanouk: We should create Positions and ask for volonteers first
(03/01 19:37:31) Nadnerb: that was my ideal ... volunteers
(03/01 19:37:35) Nadnerb: in practice though..
(03/01 19:37:39) Nadnerb: no one volunteered..
(03/01 19:37:47) Nadnerb: except the people who came up with the structure.
(03/01 19:37:54) Alderem: Your guild members are smart. :)
(03/01 19:38:29) (Crier)_Nanouk: need also a good job description
(03/01 19:38:32) Para Dox: Narym > That's basically it
(03/01 19:38:36) (Crier)_Nanouk: brb
(03/01 19:38:44) _Narym_: Well, we can do that
(03/01 19:38:55) _Narym_: What are some key positions that need to have a clearly defined head?
(03/01 19:39:08) Para Dox: The initial group of "leaders" will probably end up being the ones who are already acting as leaders on the forum
(03/01 19:39:43) Para Dox: I would suggest having the inter-guild liaisons as positions, a forum maintenance person, and any other key people in your guild
(03/01 19:39:53) Nadnerb: a feed mantinance person.
(03/01 19:39:59) Justin: sorry to interupt, but is this meeting about the GoW, GoM or just the Guilds in general?
(03/01 19:40:08) _Narym_: It's a GoMe meeting
(03/01 19:40:09) Nadnerb: we're talking about the future of the GoMe
(03/01 19:40:11) Justin: Ah
(03/01 19:40:13) Justin: Ok
(03/01 19:40:14) Justin: Jw
(03/01 19:40:20) _Narym_: but it does include discussion of Liaising between other guilds
(03/01 19:40:24) Para Dox: The positions that we have are fairly specific to certain aspects of Age Creation, your positions will be specific to your guild's needs
(03/01 19:40:32) Alderem nods to Paradox
(03/01 19:40:44) Justin: Ah
(03/01 19:40:59) Anthony: hmm
(03/01 19:41:08) Alderem: Hey, welcome back Anthony.
(03/01 19:41:27) Danne55: Hello
(03/01 19:41:39) _Narym_: hello Danne
(03/01 19:41:47) Alderem: I'm going to explain my perception of the affiliate system as it seems to stand presently.
(03/01 19:42:22) (Crier)_Nanouk: we should make Job Position Beta testing for a limited time
(03/01 19:43:02) Nadnerb spills tea, curses, and goes afk
(03/01 19:43:02) Alderem: We've got several TCT persons working with us. Lynnutte of the Relayers is working with us, Artic of the Criers with us, and Veralun from CCN has attended meetings pretty regularly here but hasn't really contributed at the forum
(03/01 19:43:31) Alderem: And that's about it. That's what I know of it.
(03/01 19:44:11) _Narym_: Do represent CCN or the Great tree in any capacity with your participation with the GoME, MArten?
(03/01 19:44:37) Alderem: I am not representing either of those groups with my participation.
(03/01 19:44:44) _Narym_: Ok. Understood
(03/01 19:44:52) _Narym_: Continue
(03/01 19:44:53) Anthony: ok
(03/01 19:45:08) (Crier)_Nanouk: I have made posts on Relayers forum only so far
(03/01 19:45:22) Alderem: It's impossible to represent CCN anyway... each member of CCN only represents him or herself. It's just how they do things.
(03/01 19:45:42) Anthony: ok
(03/01 19:46:02) Itiseye Mee: so looks like no one really reps anyone then
(03/01 19:46:07) (Crier)_Nanouk: though I was only allowed to post on Relayers
(03/01 19:46:13) Anthony: I guess not
(03/01 19:46:27) Itiseye Mee is a bit puzzled...
(03/01 19:46:33) Anthony: I'm here for TCT as well as I would assume narym is
(03/01 19:46:40) (Crier)_Nanouk: (as a Crier)
(03/01 19:47:52) Itiseye Mee: Guild or whatever I mean't. I asked Shimmer if she wanted help with photography
(03/01 19:48:04) Itiseye Mee: I ended up with the TCT
(03/01 19:48:06) (Crier)_Nanouk: so you see, your structure is not that clear for newcomers
(03/01 19:48:11) _Narym_: I represent The Archiver, I suppose, rather that TCT. But even then, I've always been happy to let Anthony forward my thougts to the GoMe, if a formal rep system started
(03/01 19:48:31) _Narym_: Maybe we should organise 'Councillors' by medium
(03/01 19:48:46) Alderem: The main idea of the affiliate system as I 've understood it was that the GoMe would distribute news to the affiliate organizations, or distribute news on their behalf. The GoMe would not dictate standards to those groups.
(03/01 19:48:59) _Narym_: most of the affiliates use differnt media anyway
(03/01 19:49:09) Itiseye Mee: Yes what Marten and yourself Narym makes alot of sense about structure
(03/01 19:49:11) Alderem: Thinking of it in light of the liaisons to the other guilds, I don't see much of a difference.
(03/01 19:50:05) _Narym_: wel, the main idea is simply to have a clear contact for each type of news, yes?
(03/01 19:50:24) (Crier)_Nanouk: agree
(03/01 19:50:31) Alderem: I think that is something for us all ot ponder as we work out the guild structure; that the affiliate system and the liaisons are somewhat the same thing. So those types of positions fit together, I think.
(03/01 19:50:42) _Narym_: And in terms of intra Guild comms, someone who understands that media enough that hey can represent the others who work with tha media
(03/01 19:51:00) _Narym_: Or am I not makings sense? :P
(03/01 19:51:06) Itiseye Mee: like Blender??lol
(03/01 19:51:47) Alderem: I think, Narym, that gets into an educational aspect that the GoMe doesn't yet have the manpower/womanpower to drive yet, but it's an area near and dear to my own heart.
(03/01 19:51:59) _Narym_: ok
(03/01 19:52:08) _Narym_: So the question still comes to...
(03/01 19:52:16) Alderem: I love to share information on how I've worked on projects with others. People are always welcome to ask.
(03/01 19:52:21) _Narym_: What, if any, positions are required outside of Inter Guild Liaisons
(03/01 19:53:26) _Narym_: Any thoughts from anyone?
(03/01 19:53:30) Alderem: I don't think I have the energy to attack that question tonight. Can we continue that discussion on the forum?
(03/01 19:53:31) (Crier)_Nanouk: we should not try ro cross a bridge before getting to the river
(03/01 19:54:00) _Narym_: ok, no problem
(03/01 19:54:03) (Crier)_Nanouk: to cross*
(03/01 19:54:12) Alderem: I think there were some suggestions earlier in this discussion, so that's something to dig out of the log file and talk about.
(03/01 19:55:12) Alderem: I'm out of topics. Unless Narym, Anthony, or Nanouk have further items to add...
(03/01 19:55:30) (Crier)_Nanouk: my suggestion: First ID a problem then...find a solution
(03/01 19:55:31) Alderem: Or Itiseye...
(03/01 19:55:37) _Narym_: No. I think any other things that I wanted to discuss are, as you say, best left for another time
(03/01 19:55:56) Alderem: Nanouk - that has been shimmer and Lynnutte's motto from the start. :)
(03/01 19:55:56) _Narym_: But structure will have to be worked out at some stage
(03/01 19:56:04) (Crier)_Nanouk: lol lol
(03/01 19:56:08) _Narym_: yes
(03/01 19:56:18) _Narym_: It's actually on the website about page, and everything :P
(03/01 19:56:35) Alderem: Okay. The floor is now open to anyone else for questions or thoughts.
(03/01 19:56:38) _Narym_: So, are there any other questions at all? The floor is open
(03/01 19:56:44) _Narym_: lol
(03/01 19:56:48) _Narym_: lag
(03/01 19:57:20) (Crier)_Nanouk: will also register at real GoMe for better
(03/01 19:57:25) Alderem: I do want to thank Paradox and Nadnerb for attending, I hope you felt that your time here was well spent, I do feel that it was, myself.
(03/01 19:57:33) _Narym_: yes
(03/01 19:57:46) Para Dox: It was nice to get an insight into the GoMe :)
(03/01 19:57:54) _Narym_: It was good to have reps here
(03/01 19:57:56) Alderem cheers
(03/01 19:58:03) Itiseye Mee: It is nice that people care
(03/01 19:58:06) _Narym_: Shame we couldn't have all guilds represented, but that will happen in time
(03/01 19:58:14) (Crier)_Nanouk: working on good foundations is always best
(03/01 19:58:23) Alderem: I knew that the GoW cared when they came to our forum to let us know they felt we could do better. :)
(03/01 19:58:32) _Narym_: lol
(03/01 19:58:40) Itiseye Mee: lol
(03/01 19:58:52) Itiseye Mee: I read that oohhh
(03/01 19:58:53) Alderem: We will do our best.
(03/01 19:58:55) _Narym_: And We have Kerryth who volunteered to work with us an the Maintainers, which is also good
(03/01 19:59:13) _Narym_: so, for the benefit of everyone
(03/01 19:59:17) (Crier)_Nanouk: all good news
(03/01 19:59:18) _Narym_:
(03/01 19:59:31) Alderem: Alright. We've eaten up 2 hours of everyone's time. So thank you for attending!
(03/01 19:59:42) _Narym_: Go there, check it out, help us out with suggestions, and also feel free to contribute any news you hear as well
(03/01 19:59:49) _Narym_: That's pretty much it.
(03/01 19:59:57) (Crier)_Nanouk: very welcome. It was pleasant
(03/01 19:59:57) Adam_Reith: TY Narym
(03/01 20:00:04) Itiseye Mee: Nice to see you again and nice to see Narym
(03/01 20:00:06) _Narym_: Meeting closed, Marten?
(03/01 20:00:14) _Narym_: lol nice to see you too, Szark
(03/01 20:00:23) Alderem: Yes, meeting closed.
(03/01 20:00:26) Alderem: Adjourned!
(03/01 20:00:40) _Narym_: Would the defendant please step down.... :P
(03/01 20:00:45) _Narym_ steps down
(03/01 20:00:47) Alderem claps his hands
(03/01 20:00:50) Adam_Reith laughs
(03/01 20:00:50) (Crier)_Nanouk: good night everybody
(03/01 20:00:50) _Narym_ claps his hands
(03/01 20:00:54) Para Dox: g'night
(03/01 20:00:58) _Narym_: night
(03/01 20:01:00) Nadnerb: g'ngiht
(03/01 20:01:01) Para Dox (I'm on the surface, be back in a minute):
(03/01 20:01:02) Nadnerb salutes
(03/01 20:01:02)
(03/01 20:01:15) Itiseye Mee: Well it is getting really late here so I will bid you all a fair well
(03/01 20:01:23) _Narym_: yeah, go to bed Szark :P
(03/01 20:01:25) Nadnerb: g'ngiht Itis
(03/01 20:01:27) (Crier)_Nanouk: bye all
(03/01 20:01:28) _Narym_: I know its late where you are
(03/01 20:01:34) Nadnerb salutes
(03/01 20:01:34) _Narym_: night nanouk
(03/01 20:01:37) Itiseye Mee thanks you
(03/01 20:01:38) _Narym_: or day
(03/01 20:01:39) Alderem: Goodnight, thank you all!
(03/01 20:01:43) _Narym_: or whatever time it is where you are
(03/01 20:01:45) Adam_Reith: Late? Why, 'tis but 1:00 am here. Early
(03/01 20:01:46) _Narym_ bows
(03/01 20:01:55) Nadnerb: heh
(03/01 20:01:55) skydiver Ravenraft (I'm on the surface, be back in a minute):
(03/01 20:01:56) _Narym_: lol
(03/01 20:01:58) Itiseye Mee thanks you
(03/01 20:01:59) Adam_Reith: :)
(03/01 20:01:59) Alderem: Narym, you've got a log? I've been logging too.
(03/01 20:02:03) Nadnerb: that kind of schedule huh?
(03/01 20:02:05) _Narym_: yeah
(03/01 20:02:09) Nadnerb has a full log as well
(03/01 20:02:11) _Narym_: I've got one
(03/01 20:02:15) _Narym_: Who wants to post it?
(03/01 20:02:19) Nadnerb: where should it be posted?
(03/01 20:02:23) _Narym_: MOUL
(03/01 20:02:30) Nadnerb: hmm.
(03/01 20:02:31) Nadnerb: ok
(03/01 20:02:33) _Narym_: maybe in the thread for this meeting?
(03/01 20:02:52) Alderem: That's a good place.
(03/01 20:02:54) _Narym_: I'll see if I can sumamrise into the main points, but I've got a lot on my plate for the next couple of days
(03/01 20:03:11) _Narym_: so are you volunteering yourself for posting the raw chat, Nadnerb?
(03/01 20:03:19) Nadnerb: uh
(03/01 20:03:22) Alderem: Sounds godo Narym. For now I'm going to post the very basic topic list, but just on the GoMe forum.
(03/01 20:03:23) Nadnerb: yeah. ;)
(03/01 20:03:32) _Narym_: Thank you Nad
(03/01 20:03:37) Nadnerb: np.
(03/01 20:03:52) _Narym_: just copy paste, that'll do for now. I'll try to get something more concise togeter in the next few days
(03/01 20:04:03) _Narym_: you know where the thread is?
(03/01 20:04:11) _Narym_: and thanks Marten
(03/01 20:04:47) _Narym_: cya soon Ant
(03/01 20:04:56) Anthony: cya
(03/01 20:05:06) _Narym_: oh wait, you didn't leave :P
(03/01 20:05:07) _Narym_: my bad
(03/01 20:05:15) Adam_Reith: goodnight all.
(03/01 20:05:27) Nadnerb: 'night
(03/01 20:05:30) Alderem: Thanks Narym. You helped a lot :)
(03/01 20:05:42) Alderem: reminded me when to move on to a new topic and such :)
(03/01 20:06:31) _Narym_: lol np
(03/01 20:06:42) _Narym_: Thanks for all those words of discussion :P

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