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PostPosted: Thu May 26, 2011 4:17 pm 
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If developers are expecting universal adulation, without a single exception, from each and every URU player...you know that's not going to happen. No matter how good you think you're being, there will always be someone that takes exception to what you're doing - especially if you're doing something substantial.

And that's to be expected, because there will always be some folks who have an investment in something that will be affected by what you're doing, some are ill-informed and need a little kindly assistance getting up to speed, and some well-intentioned people simply express themselves in an awkward fashion at times.

There are also those times when something YOU think is a great idea just doesn't get consensual support from the very people you think you're doing it for. Happens to all of us occasionally.

Look, if you really enjoy building Ages, then build Ages.
If you get a kick out of coding something that enables a new trick or improves an old one, then do it.
But KNOW that you are doing it for the sheer pleasure of seeing the outcome, for learning on the way, and because it's simply something you love to do. If you're doing this work for public acclaim, or (as said ) if you're very sensitive to the occasional critique or misunderstanding, then you're probably in for disappointment.


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PostPosted: Thu May 26, 2011 6:03 pm 
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Well... Emor pretty well nailed it. :)

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PostPosted: Thu May 26, 2011 7:12 pm 
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PostPosted: Thu May 26, 2011 8:26 pm 
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PostPosted: Thu May 26, 2011 10:34 pm 
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OK, let's clear up the "evil haxxors" thing, as I'm seeing some meaning has been lost in translation. 8)

For the TL;DR crowd, "haxxors" is neither a critique nor bullying; it's humor.

I don't like name-calling. It's often unpleasant. However, persons who are uncomfortable with the grey hats are unlikely to use the word "haxxors." I expect them to say something like "That's hacking and it's wrong!" (Of course, generalized statements like that one are usually incorrect because they leave no room for exceptions or a deeper understanding.)

I've seen the word haxxors used most when the grey hats poke fun at both themselves and at those who are complaining about their activities. It's sarcasm. Example: Hacker: "Oh noes! He is calling us Ev1L haXX0Rs!" And at times, the grey hats may even step into the role of the hecklers themselves, in anticipation of the response they've come to expect from confused and/or intolerant people. Hacker 1: "Here's a nifty thing!" Hacker 2: "Hax! LOL!"

The sense of humor among the grey hats is a good thing, even though sarcasm can sometimes be confusing to people who aren't already familiar with all of the personalities involved in a discussion. I wish it didn't need to be used so much as a defense mechanism, but I understand it.

I hope this clears up some confusion.

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PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2011 12:14 am 
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Emor, the problem isn't a "single exception" to universal adoration or even a handful, it's the vibe I get from most of this board when anything is announced it seems to be treated with suspicion at best and outbursts calling for bans at worst. Beyond that, I get a sort of passive aggressive vibe off many others (your post included, frankly) that patronizes the mature members of the coding community.

Here's the other thing, as I've said before a lot of these problems come from users not educating themselves on the work the coders do. This doesn't mean getting into coding to me. It means hanging out with the coders (not to spy on them, but to genuinely understand the issues). I think everyone can understand coder's frustration at someone who admits never learning anything about Age Writing coming in and saying that the coders' work is inferior to Cyan's work when, in fact, the coders' work is more fully featured than Cyan's. Now sure, this isn't enough on its own to make people quit, but when you compound it with the other insults and snubs over the years, spanning back to UU and beyond, I think most people can understand why this could be the straw that breaks the camel's back... and why people would be sensitive.

It's not an "occasional critique or misunderstanding," it is a constant stream of suspicion, name-calling, clique-making, rumor-spreading, and so on. If it were people expressing their dislike and leaving it at that, no one would have a problem, but it is the organized, targeted nature of the attacks against the coders that is rapidly convincing many that developing for Uru is not worth the effort.

To sum it up, if you think this is about one event, or some number of events you don't feel justify a reaction, you haven't been paying attention.

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PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2011 12:17 am 
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PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2011 12:52 am 
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PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2011 1:37 am 
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PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2011 2:05 am 
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PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2011 4:25 am 
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PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2011 1:19 pm 
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PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2011 4:38 am 
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PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2011 5:40 am 
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