New(ish) Riven D'ni transcriptions

Carolyn · **Joined:** Fri Mar 13, 2015 4:20 pm **Posts:** 24

I recently came across two previously untranscribed (as far as I know) pieces of D'ni in Riven, from multiple sources. There are no new or unknown words in either of them, but I thought I'd share them here anyway in case anyone's interested.

The first one is the D'ni text that appears around the top of the link-in cage; I noticed a particular render of the cage which appeared in a Tumblr post (which no longer seems to exist), and which was apparently taken from Tony Davidson's website in 2003, that was just high-res enough that it's possible to tell exactly what it says.

[Reveal] Spoiler: images

The text on the render:

Also, for comparison, here are the two clearest images of the text in Riven:

The text is the word tAnEem (RTS: teyneeëm; NTS: téníem) repeated over and over. The word translates as 'you welcome' - I'm not sure if that's exactly what they were aiming for. Probably also worth mentioning that the word téní wasn't known until it appeared in Uru, and then wasn't defined until April 2015.

The second new transcription is of a phrase which appears around the base of some of the objects on Gehn's desk in Age 233. It was barely visible, let alone legible, in the original game, and the contrast of the higher-res version of the view of Gehn's desk which has been circulated for years isn't great, which obscures the text. Luckily, though, the recent the ART of CYAN PDF contained a much clearer high-res render of Gehn's desk, as well as another render of one of the objects with the text. Two of the images from Tony Davidson's website also showed the phrase, one of which was on the glass bottle, which doesn't have text on it in the final game. The clearest images of the text from these sources are as follows:

[Reveal] Spoiler: images

The two clearest instances of the text in the high-res image in the ART of CYAN:

The text on the object render in the ART of CYAN:

The text on an object render from Tony Davidson's website:

The text on an old render of the bottle, from Tony Davidson's website (note that it can also be seen through the bottle):

Through comparing the various images of the text, I was able to transcribe the text as: votartEa yavo ben a relem (RTS: votahrteeah Yahvo ben ah relem; NTS: votartía Yavo ben a relem), which translates as "praise Yahvo for the ink", where 'praise' is directed at multiple people. I find it interesting that the text is praising Yahvo by name; the objects were presumably constructed by Gehn's Guild of Builders, but of course Gehn had forced the Rivenese to worship him as a god, presumably without any mention of Yahvo (which, also, if Gehn is apparently a follower of Yahvo, seems even more blasphemous). Unless the objects themselves were taken from D'ni?

I would have posted this on the GoLi forums, but they currently happen to not exist, which poses a problem when considering that course of action. :wink:

Talashar · **Joined:** Sun Dec 08, 2013 12:24 pm **Posts:** 91

The first one is odd, though I'm amused by the idea that it's meant as a reminder for Gehn's guards. :lol:

It's possible that the subject of intransitive taynee is the one welcomed, so the translation would be closer to "You are welcome." Gehn knows the importance of courtesy to one's guests!

With the other sentence we have a second example of ah being used with the object of a preposition. Contrast the roughly parallel votahr ah'shem khekamrov kenem, though the preposition is different and precedes a relative clause rather than a noun phrase. I continue to suspect ah has some sort of pragmatic function, but without better context this is basically just me waving my hands in the air and muttering about topicalization.

Jamie Marchant · **Posted:** Sat Nov 11, 2017 12:47 am

I love the amount of detail in that game! Keep up the good work! Maybe consider reposting this here: http://forums.cyan.com/viewforum.php?f=21. It might get better reception.

Carolyn · **Joined:** Fri Mar 13, 2015 4:20 pm **Posts:** 24

Jamie Marchant wrote:

Maybe consider reposting this here: http://forums.cyan.com/viewforum.php?f=21. It might get better reception.

I considered also posting it there, but the forum rules both here and there forbid crossposting, which I was worried that might fall under. Didn't want to potentially annoy moderators

Jamie Marchant · **Posted:** Sun Nov 12, 2017 5:46 pm

Uh I see.

Mac_Fife · **Posted:** Sun Nov 12, 2017 6:15 pm

Carolyn wrote:

I considered also posting it there, but the forum rules both here and there forbid crossposting, which I was worried that might fall under. Didn't want to potentially annoy moderators

Simple solution: Report your own post (use the '!' icon on the post) and in the text box ask to have it moved to the other section.

Jamie Marchant · **Posted:** Sun Nov 12, 2017 7:17 pm

I reported a thread once and Chogen said in a PM that he could not move it to the other forum. You may have to manually copy your thread there if this is what Cyan would want

.

Tai'lahr · **Posted:** Sun Nov 12, 2017 9:22 pm

Carolyn wrote:

Jamie Marchant wrote:

Maybe consider reposting this here: http://forums.cyan.com/viewforum.php?f=21. It might get better reception.

I considered also posting it there, but the forum rules both here and there forbid crossposting, which I was worried that might fall under. Didn't want to potentially annoy moderators

I wouldn't worry about that, honestly. The rule is meant to prevent spam, not keep fans from sharing information that others might find interesting. Given that there are quite likely many members on each forum that read only one and not the other, I think it's a good idea to post it there as well.

Carolyn · **Joined:** Fri Mar 13, 2015 4:20 pm **Posts:** 24

Done: http://forums.cyan.com/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=1525

Jamie Marchant · **Posted:** Mon Nov 13, 2017 2:51 pm

Cool, I subscribed too it.

Khreestrefah · **Joined:** Tue Apr 06, 2010 5:01 pm **Posts:** 163

Talashar wrote:

The first one is odd, though I'm amused by the idea that it's meant as a reminder for Gehn's guards. :lol:

It's possible that the subject of intransitive taynee is the one welcomed, so the translation would be closer to "You are welcome." Gehn knows the importance of courtesy to one's guests!

This reminds me of some ancient surface languages like Latin where the ordinary word for 'host' and for 'guest' is the same, i.e. hospes. If we paraphrase the verb taynee 'welcome' as roughly equivalent to "share hospitality with"; then we can see how the mutuality of the concept allows the subject to be either the resident or the new arrival.

Shorah

Khreestrefah · **Joined:** Tue Apr 06, 2010 5:01 pm **Posts:** 163

Talashar wrote:

With the other sentence we have a second example of ah being used with the object of a preposition. Contrast the roughly parallel votahr ah'shem khekamrov kenem, though the preposition is different and precedes a relative clause rather than a noun phrase. I continue to suspect ah has some sort of pragmatic function, but without better context this is basically just me waving my hands in the air and muttering about topicalization.

Our main evidence for the meaning of the preposition ah is its use with half a dozen verbs in D'ni to mark their direct object -- in contrast with a much larger number of verbs that are like English in indicating their direct object by placing it in the sentence immediately after the verb. Thus:

dotahgen b’set ah reooshah 'he is giving the formula to us'
vs.
rem’lah sekhen poahnt bonooets 'the lizard has acidic saliva'.

It seems possible that the basic sense of ah is to mark that something moves away from the subject either physically or notionally as a consequence of the action or state of the verb. Compare:

botahgem b'zoo ah rekor 'you will give me the book'.
bahtsahnah met tahgen ah rerooay noref 'this map gives the final route'.

This would explain the use of ah when the verb rem 'flow' is used with an object:

pod remen ah lem 'each flows ink'. (This is a sentence in the online Riven Journals, which refers again to the ink-containing beetle-shaped containers, or metaphorically to the beetles themselves.)

If ah typically marks a prepositional object as something being "given out" or "given away"; then it might be significant that two other verbs that can be used with an ah-phrase, namely votahr 'praise' and chev 'thank', each has a paraphrase in English involving the verb 'give' -- "to praise" = "to give praise" and "to thank" = "to give thanks."

This does not seem to work as well as an explanation of the usage with glahs 'drink':

gormot glahsen ah repoahnt 'it then drinks the saliva'.

But perhaps there is still a notional contrast with a verb like sekh 'have' used without ah; since there is a sense that once you drink something you no longer have it.

Shorah

New(ish) Riven D'ni transcriptions

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