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PostPosted: Sun Nov 15, 2009 3:58 pm 
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That Cyan has been constrained by time for the need to fix their code of probable licensing concerns of third party module(s) should be indicative enough that they intend to release the code under the traditional open source definitions. Otherwise, they wouldn't need to spend the time.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 15, 2009 4:14 pm 
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kaelisebonrai wrote:
Nalates wrote:
Without an idea of what the license will say we have no idea what we can or can't do. Will shard owners/operators have to sign an agreement? To use the Cyan content I would think they would have to. I think that will limit the number of shards.

Will Cyan try to limit what fan content they can put on their shards? I don't think so. There might be some typical moral turpitude type clauses to prevent Cyan content and reputation being associated with lewd or violent content. But, I can't see them making restrictions beyond that. If Krill (I use him often because I love his dragon AV's in SL) has a shard and adds dragon AV's I doubt that would be a problem. Well... for Cyan. But who knows, they may try to restrict that.

Many have decided what they think Cyan will allow and are building what they would like to see in an Uru with fan content. Traveling through the fan ages we have now, I have yet to see something that people strongly object to. So, Cyan control is not something I anticipate or feel is needed. As best I can tell, Cyan seems to feel the same way and is headed toward allowing the fans to handle fan content. I only have every heard of them protecting their part of the story and their ages.


@Nalates:

Please read the official definition of "Open Source". ( http://www.opensource.org/docs/osd )

If Cyan is to give us an "Open Source" Uru, they will have to use a license that meets this definition. They may or may not release the content under an "open source" license, however if Uru is to be open source, at the very least, the engine would most likely have to be. To be clear this is the correct definition of Open Source. There is no other to be considered. There is, however, the definition of "Free Software" which one can find at http://fsf.org/ . (Note, that "Free Software" does not refer to software without cost, that would be "freeware" instead.) It is entirely possible that Open Source software can indeed be charged for, so it does not preclude Cyan (or, infact, others) from charging for the software. This is certainly something Cyan is aware of, and has been aware of since before the announcement, considering, if I remember correctly, that in the past they have released an application as "Open Source". I believe the license, was actually the GNU GPL, from the Free Software Foundation. Of course, I could be misremembering, but in this case, if it is the one I'm thinking of, the application is hosted at a site we can't link to here, or really, even mention.


@kaelisebonrai

You do realize that Nalates is discussing Cyan content right? Cyan has already stated that it will be under a different license than the source which will be open. This is the license that has the most speculation. Cyan may well be within its right to require users to sign an agreement and to limit what type of shards its content is used on.

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 Post subject: To clarify
PostPosted: Thu Nov 19, 2009 4:19 am 
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Lets see if I follow all this.

Calam wrote:
Quote:
My understanding is that Cyan has made it clear that they would like to have some level of control over the content in OpenUru; not only for legal purposes, but for quality control ones as well.


Calam, I got the same understanding or impression from the 2009 Mysterium RAND interview.

Clat wrote:
Quote:
JW is right. Open source is just that: open, free for all. Were JW and me disagree is about desirability of this solution. He thinks (if I’m correct) that it’s the only way to have Uru again, perhaps even a better Uru. I think that simply it will be no Uru at all.
As open source is also a “Once for all”, with no way back, I still hope that Cyan will reconsider the whole idea.


Open Source means the genie is out of the bottle and there is no turning back. So CYAN and the Guilds will have to steer it as best they can and provided for through licensing and any servers set up because the fans will be off and running with it! I choose to be more optimistic and believe both will happen i.e. core uru fans will maintain the traditional Uru storyline style ages while others will trail off to a less traditional more extreme with lots in between. I would side with JW in that Open Source Uru has the greatest chance of success limited only by how much CYAN control is placed upon it through licensing and involvement. RAND seemed torn between complete Open Source where it becomes some incredible FREE Online Mega-Game success in which he can no longer profit as much from to holding on to it as some MORE type release risking it bombs out again. Open Source and it grows! MORE and it may die again! Is there some third option? Another investor? If it goes Open Source and grows into what we all believe it can be, CYAN can still make and sell ages to us. Right? Others can charge for their ages and shards. Right?


JWPlatt wrote:
Quote:
That Cyan has been constrained by time for the need to fix their code of probable licensing concerns of third party module(s) should be indicative enough that they intend to release the code under the traditional open source definitions. Otherwise, they wouldn't need to spend the time.


I recall hearing about the employee module/ plugin issue for an Open Source release to getting the game back online. This “ongoing” issue appears to have no realistic time limit or resolution other than wait and see.
The Source Code and/or Game Engine was announced is to be Open Source “FREE” to use and with tools to build and make ages with. Not clear if the same FCAL ( Fan Created Art License) from @ Cyan Legal will be the final license with a Open Source/ and content license agreement. To be clear, CYAN Myst Uru game age content was not announced to be Open Source, but is to be licensed under some other arrangement to be determined. Right? The 2009 Mysterium/ Rand interview suggested to me some reluctance and desire to maintain some control over content with possible MORE type arrangement and possible CYAN run server.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 19, 2009 7:36 am 
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They're releasing the client and server code as Open-Source, but keeping the content closed-source.

This means it's still possible for them to profit from them (even more so, in fact), as if someone wants to play they have to have the Cyan content (At least, until someone creates a completely new set of ages that will work independent of the Cyan ages). This is a similar situation to the Open Sourcing of the Quake engine - You can compile the engine, and play the (shareware) demo all you like, but to obtain the full game, no matter what engine build you're using, you still have to buy Quake from iD. It also means that, sometime down the line, Cyan can create some more ages for Uru, and release them in a paid-for manner, and make money from this open-source project.

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 Post subject: CYAN - Profit & Play
PostPosted: Thu Nov 19, 2009 11:17 am 
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Anaerin wrote:
Quote:
This means it's still possible for them to profit from them (even more so, in fact), as if someone wants to play they have to have the Cyan content (At least, until someone creates a completely new set of ages that will work independent of the Cyan ages). This is a similar situation to the Open Sourcing of the Quake engine - You can compile the engine, and play the (shareware) demo all you like, but to obtain the full game, no matter what engine build you're using, you still have to buy Quake from iD. It also means that, sometime down the line, Cyan can create some more ages for Uru, and release them in a paid-for manner, and make money from this open-source project.


Great Anaerin! :D Sounds good to me and I say good for CYAN! Sign me up and lets play! Bring it on CYAN!


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 19, 2009 8:56 pm 
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Great summary, Anaerin.

And yes, I'm in, whenever it arrives :D

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 Post subject: Re: CYAN - Profit & Play
PostPosted: Thu Nov 19, 2009 10:40 pm 
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Jahmen wrote:
Anaerin wrote:
Quote:
This means it's still possible for them to profit from them (even more so, in fact), as if someone wants to play they have to have the Cyan content (At least, until someone creates a completely new set of ages that will work independent of the Cyan ages). This is a similar situation to the Open Sourcing of the Quake engine - You can compile the engine, and play the (shareware) demo all you like, but to obtain the full game, no matter what engine build you're using, you still have to buy Quake from iD. It also means that, sometime down the line, Cyan can create some more ages for Uru, and release them in a paid-for manner, and make money from this open-source project.


Great Anaerin! :D Sounds good to me and I say good for CYAN! Sign me up and lets play! Bring it on CYAN!
Agreed that sounds awesome. I'm so ready for that.


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