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Bring Back The Guilds?
Yes. 30%  30%  [ 59 ]
No 22%  22%  [ 43 ]
What Guilds Are You Talking About? 7%  7%  [ 13 ]
Only Some That Could Help People: (ex-The Writers, Linguists, Messengers) 24%  24%  [ 47 ]
Start Modern Guilds Only (Greeters etc.) 16%  16%  [ 32 ]
Total votes : 194
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PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2006 2:58 pm 
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Zardoz wrote:
Of course, I'm wondering if the liaisons feel they are privileged or whether they are being punished . . . ;)


Trust me, it's the latter. ;)


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PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2006 3:46 pm 
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But a key feature of this system, IMHO, would be competition. If someone doesn't like the DLF, they are free to start their own linguistic club. This would create more opportunities, more inclusiveness, fewer opportunities for corruption, and a richer environment.

Absolutely! :) Calling it competition makes me a little nervous (since competitions have winners and losers); I try to think about it as rather nonexclusivity. If a group of folks doesn't like the way the DLF is approaching linguistic studies, or TCT is producing in-cavern news and media, or the Guild of Greeters is orienting new explorers, they should absolutely have the resources and opportunities to create their own groups.

My deep hope is that it doesn't become a "choose sides" situation, with groups pitted against each other, but a "diversity of options" situation, where individual explorers can participate in as many interest groups, even multiple groups addressing the same interest, as they like. I even hope that, if a new D'ni language group did want to start up for example, that they actually come to the DLF for advice and support, to find out what has worked, what hasn't worked, what plans are in the works, and so on. And I hope that the communities already in place extend their knowledge, experience, and expertise to others who are interested in doing things differently. I'm all for a proliferation of communities, as long as the model is one of mutual support, collaboration, etc. -- working to the greater good of all explorers!

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PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2006 4:16 pm 
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I'm not sure I'd really like in-cavern guilds of any kind......As has been said, they tend to become elitists with their special clothing and titles.....Forum guilds are beneficial and offer areas to go for information. For example: If I want a map or if I want to learn the D'ni language etc., I could visit one of the guild forums.....To create official in-cavern elite groups, IMO....fosters division and I'd really hate to see Uru relaunched with division already in place...

SG


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PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2006 4:46 pm 
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I'm okay with guilds as long as they're optional. People find ways to group together anyway, so why not make it along a line of common interest? Guilds do not necessarily equal conflict.


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PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2006 4:52 pm 
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i don't mind guilds, as long as they don't encourage the "us vs. them" mentality, or get too exclusive in their membership.

for some purposes, it would even seem foolish to -not- have an organized approach to a particular area. for example, when it comes to our understanding of the language(s) of D'ni, it seems silly to me to have two groups doing the same work. Much better to have all the information in one place.

age writing is another area where a guild could be both helpful and potentially detrimental. it would be good to have all the information on how to do it in one place, as well as having a place to store common models & textures. however, requiring guild membership in order to write ages would be too divisive.

just my 0.02...

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PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2006 8:13 pm 
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My take on having any Guilds within the Cavern are those that have been officially sanctioned by Cyan. Like the Guild of Greeters which was formed during the UrU Beta and commissioned by Cyan and Ubisoft to serve the purpose of "greeting" new explorers to the Cavern. So needless to say, the Guild of Greeters is technically directly answerable to Cyan for any misconduct that may happen.

If other Guilds are set up the same way and with official permission to do so, then I feel it is a good thing to have areas like this. As long as Cyan believes this will benefit the overall game play and bring more options for things to do within the Cavern, then why not. :D

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PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2006 9:18 pm 
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I’m going to draw peoples attention back to CCN (I’m good at that) CCN does a lot of things, but as a group we have our own format and way of doing things. There are people who want to do podcasts and newsletters and vidcasts their own way. Working with CCN isn't for everyone. We have a very definite stance on what we want to be not exactly a reporting agency but not a purely creative one something in between.

If CCN (sorry not to confuse TCT is a part of CCN which does many things) were the recognised group to go to for all podcast stuff then it doesn't help other people or encourage them to do their own ideas. It makes it harder to enter the same place.

A guild gives a form of official recognition and I know if a guild of artisans were to start I would try to get CCN to promote other members of the guild, and i would hope that other members did the same. SO if anyone one group got successful and someone started a new project or had something to offer the more popular organisations would provide support to them to help them be recognised for their work.

As for guilds being exclusive there is some reason for that, take CCN we wouldn't want a DRC member or a DRC liaison to be part of the production cast. Not because we don't want their input, or we don't value what they can do, but because we fear that at the moment we are a semi news agency, and may go further in that direction in the future. To accept such a person may in the eyes of others compromise our integrity (think cronyism.) I realise that sounds dramatic and probably an over reaction but a recent conflagration involving TCT shows that people expect news agencies to be completely impartial. However I don't believe guilds should be elitist or seperate from the community, we are all just explorers I wouldn't lock any one person our of a guild for any reason.

Guilds aren't for every part of cavern life, I can't see there being a need for a guild for the greeters, they have a group its a highly respected group and they do a good job but things such as age writing and creativity and news might benefit from a guild.

Oh and CCN doesn't exclude anyone from any group we want people from Slackers to Tapestry to be part of the team, the DRC thing is a pure politics issue and unique for TCT.

On a final note I can only speak for CCN but we as a group are a very loose conglomeration of people, there is no grand high master we rely on teamwork, and just have a central co-ordinator to make sure things are working properly. There is no ultimate head, there is no highly defined structure, people take on certain roles that suit them best. A guild would benefit from this type of structure as well. I believe most of the groups work on a similar principle.

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Last edited by Stevecrox on Wed May 10, 2006 10:47 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2006 9:33 pm 
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Yep, Knew This Would Cause A Discussion.

So, I Agree With Guilds Being Optional (of course, there were probably those people in ancient D'ni that belonged to no guild) And I voted for modern guilds, because they are just soo helpful to all the explorers.

But Alas, I feel like Ghen here :oops:, but I would just love to be part of a guild, with colors and robes and our OWN GUILD HALL! OMGosh that would be great! Plus the guilds could help bring projects, and new things to the Empire, uhhhh I mean D'ni...the cavern...you know what I mean.

And the new guilds would know what to look for (well, if you've played the Uru and/or read the books) to stop Guild Gluttony (ha :lol:) from becoming a problem.

Think of all the good we could do with the guilds if we THINK while making them.

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PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2006 9:43 pm 
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:D Well said, Wolfie. Anyone who thinks that being a Greeter is an elitist thing ought to try working a 2 hr shift with people demanding attention at the rate of 6 or more at a time and being rude if one is not able to answer every question immediately.

I loved the job and think it is a big help to new explorers. I was so lost as a new beta so I know how confusing it can be and how wonderful it was to find people who would even go with me to show me what to do.

This is voluntary and unpaid except in friendship and good feelings. I would hate to see it gone because some people will always find a reason to criticize other groups to which they haven't offered their services.

End of today's rant............cat

...but never assume I won't find another topis about which to work up a good lather! :wink:

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PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2006 10:23 pm 
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Personally, if we are to have guilds I would only like to see Cyan sanctioned OOC Guilds - if they were voluntary guilds designed for informational, historical and entertaining reasons rather than elitism and rivalries.

Next to physical limitations, the main reason I don't get involved with other online games is due to the ranking systems and conflicts that appear to be the norm. I love my adventure games and play to relax and enjoy, to think and to learn - not fight, scheme and manipulate. I'd hate to see that happen here. :(

I find the idea of going to an OOC Guild site for my needs preferable to doing so IC. Although most here are reasonable and mature enough to avoid potential conflicts, there is no way to avoid the troublemakers who we all know will eventually surface and attempt to abuse any system that may be in place.


So please.....Don't Feed The Trolls! Let them do their grazing OOC. :D


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PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2006 10:33 pm 
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If we could belong to more than one 'hood, then our hoods would sort-of be a guild in themselves. Add a couple levels (major, vice-majors and normal users) and you're done for what I think we'll ever need in Cavern.

I don't think we need a strong guild system inside the game. Organized groups already do that in their own forums and websites, where most of the administration power is required. Also, in Uru we don't have to gather materials or build compounds or that sort of stuff.

True, having some guild perks like clothing and 'hood customizations would be nice, but they'd just be extras.


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PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2006 10:49 pm 
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A novice logging in to be confronted with a Guild for this and a Guild for that – believe me won’t stay long. And what of the other mere mortals who remain – those that aren’t affiliated to any Guilds? Having these exclusively regaled groups and sheep-strutting followers, holding clandestine trysts to discuss unwritten laws, reverberates in echoes from the past, and the fall of D’ni.

Who are these entrepreneurs that really seek the homage of your everyday puzzle solver?

I for one do not wish to be controlled and would vehemently oppose such an idea. There is no call for hierarchy among Explorers – we are all on an equal footing. In essence, the idea of Guildmasters for me is a definite 'no-no'.

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PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2006 10:56 pm 
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I don't think anyone wants to make a guild the old D'ni way, or something that looks like your company's organizational plan. Guilds can be just be places for people with the same interests to meet, or just friendly chat places. You can call them "clubs" or "neighborhoods" instead of "guilds", but the substance is pretty much the same. Are people scared to see many 'hoods at the moment? Then they probably won't be scared by a non-mandatory and lightweight guild system.


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PostPosted: Thu May 11, 2006 12:31 am 
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I am generally opposed to in-game guilds because of the elitist and exclusionary practices that appear in some on-line games that have such guild systems. In those kinds of situations you invite trouble and discourage new players by creating a hurtful environment. The competition for "leveling" guilds can be quite destructive, especially if guild membership is required to fully experience the game.

However, I think if everyone could join in fun or helpful guilds based upon a desire to make the Cavern experience more pleasant for everyone, that would be good. But only if guild membership is not required to fully appreciate the Cavern.

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PostPosted: Thu May 11, 2006 12:52 am 
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Bring on guilds and all that good stuff. Cus I want to totally own everyone...


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